High Court Backs Police No-Knock Searches

  High Court Backs Police No-Knock Searches

Posted by CN Staff on June 15, 2006 at 10:42:06 PT
By Associated Press 
Source: Associated Press 

Washington, DC -- The Supreme Court ruled Thursday that police armed with a warrant can barge into homes and seize evidence even if they don't knock, a huge government victory that was decided by President Bush's new justices. The 5-4 ruling signals the court's conservative shift following the departure of moderate Sandra Day O'Connor. Dissenting justices predicted that police will now feel free to ignore previous court rulings that officers with search warrants must knock and announce themselves or run afoul of the Constitution's Fourth Amendment ban on unreasonable searches.
Justice Antonin Scalia, writing for the majority, said Detroit police acknowledge violating that rule when they called out their presence at a man's door, failed to knock, then went inside three seconds to five seconds later. The court has endorsed longer waits, of 15 seconds to 20 seconds. "Whether that preliminary misstep had occurred or not, the police would have executed the warrant they had obtained, and would have discovered the gun and drugs inside the house," Scalia wrote. Suppressing evidence is too high of a penalty, Scalia said, for errors by police in failing to properly announce themselves. The outcome might have been different if O'Connor were still on the bench. She seemed ready, when the case was first argued in January, to rule in favor of Booker Hudson, whose house was searched in 1998. O'Connor had worried aloud that officers around the country might start bursting into homes to execute search warrants. She asked: "Is there no policy of protecting the homeowner a little bit and the sanctity of the home from this immediate entry?" She retired before the case was decided, and a new argument was held so that Justice Samuel Alito could participate in deliberations. Alito and Bush's other Supreme Court pick, Chief Justice John Roberts, supported Scalia's opinion. Hudson's lawyers argued that evidence against him was connected to the improper search and could not be used at his trial. He was convicted of drug possession. Scalia said that a victory for Hudson would have given "a get-out-of-jail-free card" to him and others. In a dissent, four justices complained that the decision erases more than 90 years of Supreme Court precedent. "It weakens, perhaps destroys, much of the practical value of the Constitution's knock-and-announce protection," Justice Stephen Breyer wrote for himself and the three other liberal members. Breyer said that police can now enter homes without knocking and waiting a short time if they know that there is no punishment for it. Justice Anthony M. Kennedy, a moderate, joined the conservatives in most of the ruling. He wrote his own opinion, however, to say "it bears repeating that it is a serious matter if law enforcement officers violate the sanctity of the home by ignoring the requisites of lawful entry." Kennedy said that legislatures can intervene if police officers do not "act competently and lawfully." He also said that people whose homes are wrongly searched can file a civil rights lawsuit. And Scalia wrote that there are public-interest law firms and attorneys who specialize in civil rights grievances. In response, Breyer said there is no evidence of anyone collecting much money in such cases. The case is Hudson v. Michigan, 04-1360. Source: Associated Press (Wire)Published: Thursday, June 15, 2006 Copyright: 2006 Associated Press CannabisNews Justice Archives

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Comment #120 posted by Richard Zuckerman on June 19, 2006 at 10:45:56 PT:
This is a United States Supreme Court decision, with a dissenting opinion, interpreting the United States Constitution, which has our "Bill of Rights" at the end of the document.Most, if not all, State Constitutions have the individual freedoms at the BEGINNING of the document! Doesn't this gives you some idea of the priority for individual freedoms intended? While having resided in The State of New Jersey, I have noticed the New Jersey Supreme Court construe the 1947 New Jersey Constitution to give MORE PROTECTION than the U.S. Supreme Court in identical fact scenarios!! Read what the U.S. Supreme Court dissenting opinions have to say and consider asserting them while asserting a violation of the analogous State Constitutional provision.Unfortunately, public schools seem to avoid teaching about your State Constitution. As an example, the Center for State Constitutional Studies, Rutgers University School of Law, Camden, New Jersey, told me recently that some time around 1997 they were paid by the State to produce a movie about the history of the New Jersey Constitution, in celebration of the 1947 New Jersey Constitution. They did produce the movie and mailed a VCR videotape to every High School or every school in New Jersey, but they DID NOT RECEIVE ONE SINGLE REPLY FROM ANY OF THE SCHOOLS!!!! Of the 100 people I have asked in the New Brunswick, New Jersey, area, mostly Rutgers University students, only about three of them knew that the 1947 New Jersey Constitution was made at Rutgers University, New Brunswick, New Jersey!!! I graduated from Arthur L. Johnson Regional High School, 365 Westfield Avenue, Clark Township, New Jersey, 07066, way back in June of 1976, during the time George Herbert Walker Bush rose to power. In 1980, I voted for George Herbert Walker Bush for U.S. President. While residing at 101 Benjamin Street, Cranford, New Jersey, I saw a group of young White males spray paint a Swastika symbol on the street in front of the house, but I did not think to run out to confront them, though. [If it happened nowadays, I'd be out there with my cell phone to call the police with their license plate numbers and perhaps with Kali sticks in case I would need to rock and roll!! If I am arrested for it, I would provide written demand to testify to the Grand Jury. The State Constitutional Right to a Grand Jury should include the Right to testify if written request is timely made. In New York, they have a law requiring dismissal of the indictment if the timely written request to testify is not honored. This is a hot button, NOVEL, issue which should be litigated in the State Courts asserting the State Constitutional Right to Indictment! The State Constitutional Right to indictment is meaningless, worthless, if the target of the investigation does not have an opportunity to testify to the Grand Jury!!!!!!]. I was not taught about the dark history of the U.S. Government, I.e., that the Bush Family and Rockefeller financed 40% of the steel production for Adolph Hitler, secretly provided shipments of Standard Oil of New Jersey to Uncle Adolph during an Oil Embergo, that Nazis were brought into this country at the end of WWII, some of whom came right here at Rutgers University in New Brunswick, New Jersey. See, e.g.:; type "New Jersey and the Nazis" into any search engine, download it and read it! Shadow of the Swastika, It wasn't until afterwards did I begin to learn in drips and drabs from underground newsletters like Militia of Montana [which, by the way, sells the book describing how government can cause weather disasters via Nikola Tesla microwaves, entitled The Earthquake Machine, by Dale Pond and Walter Baumgartner, Cat. No. 696, at a cost of $17!!!! And the book entitled Defensive Racism, by Edgar Steele, Cat. No. 624, for $30], (telephone number)(406) 847-2735, and the White Aryan Resistance newspaper! Never again will I vote for a Bush! New Jersey State Senator Thomas Kean, Jr., who recently received a visit and endorsement by Laura Bush, is running for U.S. Senator on the Republican ticket. He drove Elizabethtown Gas and NUI into the ground, but his campaign commercial claims he is a "proven success!" I am registered to vote as a LIBERTARIAN! Although I like his anti-illegal immigration position, I would not dare vote for him! Nor the Democrats!! I'll vote for Ralph Nader, Libertarian Party, or perhaps Green Party candidates only! The Republicans and Democrats have lost my confidence, COMPLETELY!! On June 8, 2006, the New Jersey State Police barred me from entering the State House Annex, Trenton, New Jersey, to attend the hearing on the Medical Marijuana Bill, New Jersey State Senate Bill 88. I sent a letter to the New Jersey Public Advocate, but he [Mr. Chen] is giving me the cold shoulder! I sent a copy of the letter to the New Jersey chapter of the American Civil Liberties Union, but they will probably do the same. This past Friday, a New Jersey State Police Sergeant, accompanied by two North Brunswick, N.J., policemen, visited me at my place of residence to interview me about the comments "You fucking Democrats" made in an angry intonation to New Jersey State Assemblyman Peter Barnes, the day after the Medical Marijuana hearing. They initially asked to interview me up in my room. Wearing my ACLU shirt, I refused them. One of the patrolmen whined to the effect: "Aww c'mon, let's go up to your room." We went in the backyard. I told the New Jersey State Police Sergeant that if they do not allow me entrance into the State House Annex I will file a lawsuit alleging violation of the 1947 New Jersey Constitution. He said that he could have me force medicated if he wants but declined to arrest me. I'm awaiting oral argument in the Appellate Divison of the Superior Court of New Jersey, in the case of Richard Paul Zuckerman, Plaintiff v. Borough of Highland Park, et al., Defendants, Docket number A-004461-04T1. The Case Manager is Edward Costantini, (telephone number)(609) 292-4822, who informed recently that I must wait until this coming October or November for appellate oral argument to be scheduled because they have an unprecedented number of appeals in which oral argument is demanded. There appears to be no accountabilility of torts by public employees of the Borough of Highland Park, The trial judge, Nicholas J. Stroumtsos, Jr., J.S.C., Middlesex County Court House, has been dicking me around since the 2000 filing day, dismissed my appeal initially, which resulted in the Appellate Division reversing and remanding, then dismissing again, which is now pending awaiting appellate oral argument in this second time around!!! I'd like to see Judge Stroumtsos, (chambers telephone number)(732) 981-3102, (law clerk)(732) 981-3074, transfered to the Admiralty Court!!!! I AM ASKING THE APPELLATE DIVISION PANEL TO ESTABLISH A CAUSE OF ACTION FOR RETALIATORY PROSECUTION UNDER THE STATE CONSTITUTIONAL FREEDOM OF SPEECH, which the trial judge ruled has never been allowed, even though the federal courts established a cause of action for Retaliation under the U.S. Constitutional freedom of speech over 30 years ago!!! We need to fight for our State Constitutional Rights, people! The federal constitutional litigation under 42 U.S.C. Section 1983 has some serious shortcomings, such as more immunity for police defendants, more curtailment of punitive damages, no vicarious liability towards public entity for a violation of the federal constitution committed by one of their public employees, and longer waiting time for trials. The Bush Administration's "plan for a New American Century" is not about preserving our individual freedoms, people!! I leave you people with the quote from, from the streets of New Jersey: "Make a law. Make a business." Riiight! Make more laws against Marijuana, so the C.I.A. can launder more drug money and more drugs!!!Richard Paul Zuckerman, Box 159, Metuchen, New Jersey, 08840-0159, (Cell telephone)(848) 250-8879, richardzuckerman2002 REGISTERED TO VOTE IN LIBERTARIAN PARTY.
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Comment #119 posted by FoM on June 18, 2006 at 08:44:13 PT
You're right it probably was a form letter. I think the 4 days together for Linda and Jerry will be the best time of their life. It's like when a soldier comes home on leave for a few days. It becomes magical but good times do end. Sometimes I think without the hard times we have in life would we really appreciate the good when it comes our way.
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Comment #118 posted by Toker00 on June 18, 2006 at 03:23:45 PT
That's probably a form letter they send out to anyone who wants to know about transfers. Nothing definite was said. Only that they are jacking with his meds and that they would "consider" a transfer. But I DO want to be optimistic, so maybe they will either release Jerry early, or loosen his visitation restrictions or something. I'm just shocked they answered your letter at ALL. Linda said she is leaving next week to visit Jerry. They will have four days to visit. They will be allowed to sit and eat together. This will be a bitter/sweet time for them. (My words , not hers.) They will have to absorb enough of each other to last till the next visit. God bless 'em.As far as leaders go, there are none. There is a King who hasn't taken the throne yet, but whose reign is growing neigh. The rest is simply the chaos resulting from the Original Disobedience. We KNOW who our leader is, and it is not a man. Therefore, we must follow the one and only leader, God. It's up to each of us to find God's lead. Our only purpose is to follow, not lead, but first we must recognize who the leader is. God. Not Man. Man can influence and be influenced by the spirit he keeps inside. Beware the false influence of Satan, because therein lies the chaos. Satan will lead you, but only astray. Ask the Republicans.I know that you here at Cnews are influenced by the lead of God. My spirit recognizes and witnesses your spirit every time I come here. We are not saints, but we are definitely awash in the spirit. The spirit of Truth, Compassion, Patience and Long Suffering. We have NO sympathy for the Devil. None. Wage peace on war. END CANNABIS PROHIBITION NOW!   
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Comment #117 posted by user123 on June 17, 2006 at 17:34:21 PT:
Talk about your activist judges!
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Comment #116 posted by FoM on June 17, 2006 at 16:41:18 PT
About Jerry
I just received a letter from Jerry's warden. I didn't expect a response from him.From the letter: Once the medical needs of Mr. Sisson have been met and he is medically cleared for transfer, Mr. Sisson will be considered for a transfer closer to his home and family.
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Comment #115 posted by FoM on June 17, 2006 at 16:24:36 PT
All done.
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Comment #114 posted by Had Enough on June 17, 2006 at 16:20:17 PT

FoM. Delete his post as requested.
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Comment #113 posted by FoM on June 17, 2006 at 16:19:34 PT

Hi how are you doing? I'm glad you liked CSNY's web site. We will see them two times this summer. We will be at the last show which will be really good I'm sure. We only got lawn tickets because they are so expensive but they have a big screen for us to see and plenty of loud, good music to hear. Lots of people are getting tickets to see them back at Woodstock.
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Comment #112 posted by SirEbram on June 17, 2006 at 16:11:29 PT

FoM (comment # 103)
Sweet website.
I just listened to a few of their song samples.
It took me back to memory lane and I'm only 26; lol!I would love to buy one of their tickets and be a part of their freedom of speech 06 tour.Crosby, Stills, Nash & Young... still rockin'.
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Comment #110 posted by charmed quark on June 17, 2006 at 16:04:48 PT

Max Flowers - most drug warrants are "no knocks&qu
Currently, if the warrant is for something like drugs that can easily be flushed or disposed of in some way, the police can and generally do apply for a "no-knock" warrant. That's something the Supremes started allowing, I think, about 25 years ago.Although it is normally not the regular police that go after these no-knocks, due to their danger, but the various special drug enforcement "SWAT" groups.The current ruling means that for anything, even if it can't be easily disposed of, the police can just barg in. Putting them and you at risk. Imagine using SWATs for everything!I'm hoping that most police departments will realize the risk of such actions and avoid doing it. 
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Comment #109 posted by Had Enough on June 17, 2006 at 15:51:36 PT

How about mrs runruff. Doesn't she have her address already posted here? You live near her I think.
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Comment #108 posted by museman on June 17, 2006 at 15:50:11 PT:

The music
Could it be done digitally? Through the net? I have a couple of ftp sites that wouldn't be too much of a security risk. Since my public email is available on several of my web sites, I will enable it for this post. here's a link to some very old music-that band I spoke of with that amp. This was a live rehearsal. We did have a small P.A. for that. Lousy quality, but it's there.
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Comment #107 posted by Had Enough on June 17, 2006 at 15:42:56 PT

I think it can be done with a little help from from our freinds. I need a place to send it. I'll get a sealed copy, and send it. But..... addresses here, I'm not sure about.
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Comment #106 posted by museman on June 17, 2006 at 15:38:36 PT

I'm game.
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Comment #105 posted by Had Enough on June 17, 2006 at 15:34:56 PT

re: #104 museman
We NEED to get you a copy of it. Somehow. You have to study/experience this music.
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Comment #104 posted by museman on June 17, 2006 at 15:27:01 PT

Had Enough
I did manage to hear the first four songs, but after that the links didn't work anymore. The sound was good, and yes I heard that old tube distortion. Nothing like it. Had a twin once. I used to stand behind it and watch the blue field run up and down the tubes with the signal from the guitar. I once powered my first band from that one amp- bass, guitar, and vocals. It fried spectacularly at the very end of an incredible psychedelic moment around the time of the 'Harmonic Convergence.'
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Comment #103 posted by FoM on June 17, 2006 at 15:21:11 PT

Had Enough
They have this T-shirt on CSNY's web site. What I like is what it says. It says: Back Where It All Began.
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Comment #102 posted by museman on June 17, 2006 at 15:20:22 PT

I understand your inclusion of the many levels of human consciousness, in that all of us need some kind of guidance at some point. A lot of that guidance is supposed to happen within the community. The parents are the first line in the battle of light and darkness. Guidance is necessary. Leadership is not. In fact with proper guidance the understandings that most of us share on this site for example, would be a lot more universal.As a parent I understand guidance. I also thoroughly understand the human phenomenon of stubborn, willful obstinance as exemplified in the teens. One cannot force truth upon anyone.As a father I understand the responsibility I have had to assume over the sovereignty of my childrens being until they came of significant age and maturity to take, and make their own destiny. But I do not lead my children. I learned a long time ago that the best and worst teacher is by example, just in day to day living. The times when I had to 'exert my authority' often resulted in more failure than success-in the long run. If I strive towards my own honesty, integrity, committments and good behavior, then my children learned "while I wasn't looking." They learned both my good and bad bnehavior the same way. Of course the time that I have spent in positive interaction; playing games, music, spending pleasant time together has been the most potent. But leading horses to water can be a frustrating experience if you think they are going to drink just because you've made the offer.Guidance is necessary, but only by example is it really accomplished, it cannot be taught by rote or concept, though it may be discussed and shared.
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Comment #101 posted by Had Enough on June 17, 2006 at 15:11:12 PT

museman.On another note.Have you heard the entire Living With War album yet? I saw a post a while back that said you were having a hard time streaming it. You have to hear it start to finish, its like one song put together. Listen for the horns, they get clearer and clearer as it goes on, has to be a reference to the border issue.The guitars sound like they are plugged into a Fender Reverb Amp. Twin Reverb, Super Reverb, or maybe a Showman Amp. It has that distorted sound, hardly heard today. I know you can relate to that. Been a while since I’ve heard that tone. Tube Tone 6L6GC, 6550 power tubes. The ones that have the purple glow to them.

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Comment #100 posted by museman on June 17, 2006 at 15:01:22 PT

I've had them. Disgusting turn of events. There's nothing more annoying than to have to actually literally turn around and tell people to "Stop Following Me!"But you see, if I am a 'born' (or made) leader it is only in the perspective of the follower. I do not believe in 'perfection' I kind of look at the word as 'spiritual catch 22' because the most perfect man ever recorded is noted to have said "Good? Who're you calling good? There is none good but the Father in Heaven."I am human. I make mistakes. It's one thing to make the mistake for myself, then hopefully learn not to repeat it, it's another making mistakes for others, that's a quagmire that one often goes down into instead of rises out of.If I, whom some have seen some expectation of 'leadership' am fallable, perhaps even blind in ways that I do not even know, the qualities, knowledge or experience that 'makes' me to be perceived in that light, precludes me from making the error of thinking I could lead anyone but myself. Seeing the horrific errors of contemporary 'authority' the idea that anyone cannot be corrupted by the system which thrives in corruption is ludicrous. To think that one could 'change things from the inside out' well at least in the political system that's pure BS.The leader is the one who knows what to do at the moment, at the place, and the circumstances that demand it. One cannot be a 'leader for all contingencies.' Such systems as man has been forced to accept like the current one, are all made of as God put it; "The Basest Of Men." The intention is to let man know that God does not approve of our leaders either.
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Comment #99 posted by FoM on June 17, 2006 at 14:45:53 PT

What a Good Leader Is To Me
A good leader is one that won't get in the way. A leader should be one to teach and then let go. If we had someone as President that looks at the responsibility of leadership this way maybe we would appreciate having a leader.
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Comment #98 posted by museman on June 17, 2006 at 14:42:53 PT

And I agree with your perspective on it.That understanding seems to be scarce in the 'religious' community...actually twisted into a dogmatic serving of the very class of assuming humanity who are trained in the "best schools" to become politicians, or 'leaders.'The Emporer is truly naked, and the simplicity of the choices and the revelation of the truth takes some unencumbered vision to see clearly, most specially after the incredible made-for-TV reality omnipresent in the last 4 generations.It's going to take a lot of strong people to survive what's coming, and those survivors are going to need some good information if the 'picking up the pieces' is going to accomplish anything other than reset the game with some armed feudal result to restart 'civilization.'That's why I appreciate Cnews, and the folks who post and discuss information and knowledge in a broad but focused way. This opportunity is valuable to all who come to CNews, and I respect the alikeness, as well as the difference between us. We have a mighty agreement, and that can not be discounted by anyone. Prohibit Prohibition.
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Comment #97 posted by Had Enough on June 17, 2006 at 14:35:41 PT

Looking for Leaders
Museman. I hear your message.Good leaders are not control freaks. Control freaks that end up as leaders are the ones that will lead people off the cliff. Blind followers will go anywhere, as long as they think they are being led.My view of leadership is not to Rule using fear, money, or social position as motivation. If you motivate people properly, let them function on their own, I believe you have better results. Now that is in a perfect world. In the real world you always have the individuals that “take” more than they “will” contribute. These people put their burden on others.The reason I believe you are critical of Leaders is because you are a leader yourself. Look what you have done, where you have been. You have seen a lot, been there and done it. For you to have made the choices you made, and survived, shows me you have leadership qualities. Natural born leaders have a hard time following fools.Feet don't fail me now. ;)

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Comment #96 posted by FoM on June 17, 2006 at 14:32:12 PT

It makes sense to me.
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Comment #95 posted by whig on June 17, 2006 at 14:29:49 PT

Leadership can be a real trap, because it leads most people to think of themselves as better than others. Whenever one of us elevate ourselves and see ourselves elevated, we risk pride and destruction.I think we are all leaders here, though, in that we all speak from our hearts and cause the rest to think and perhaps agree. In this agreement one led with an idea or a statement, and another followed, but it is not because the first was a leader and the second a follower.I hope that makes sense.
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Comment #94 posted by FoM on June 17, 2006 at 14:26:21 PT

You aren't looking for a leader because you are a leader. That is your personality I think. I am not a leader but I do my best to follow directions and not offend too many people or at least I try not to. What that means to me is some do need a leader.
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Comment #93 posted by whig on June 17, 2006 at 14:26:19 PT

Agreed.That man you would have followed would have told you that you should not, because he was not here to lead but only to show the way.You have to walk it yourself if you choose.All of us here are showing the way we go, by our own words and explanations of how we think about things. None of us leads nor follows another, but we all learn from one another.This is the way I go.And if I misstep, or fall, I hope I am given some assistance and not followed over a cliff.We are not to martyr ourselves for our cause. That is my firm belief today. We are to live, to do well for our friends as we can, and to suffer no more than we must for the sake of learning what we need.Would that we could suffer not at all, but this cannot be, because true compassion does not seem to come another way.One who knows pain and hunger will not readily inflict it upon another.Just my thoughts of the moment. Thanks for sharing yours too.
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Comment #92 posted by museman on June 17, 2006 at 14:17:11 PT

Looking for a leader...Hmmm.Maybe that is part of the problem? That we think we need to be "led." Perhaps the human race should grow up and stop delegating their own self-determinate responsibility?If most of the human race are nothing more intellectually, emotionally, and spiritually evolved than 13 year olds, then I concede the unfortunate need for a good shephard to guide them into learning that responsibility.I however, for one, need no stinking leaders. I tell my feet where to go, and usually they go there. Someone else has tried many times to tell my feet to go there, and funny thing, my feet just won't go unless "I" tell them to go.To legislate responsibilty and enforce morality upon the entire world is an assumption of biblical proportion. Or is it that there are "some people" who need to be controlled, or at least "some other people" who think so.There is theory in play, manifested in the current socio/political/economic/religious system to which most of us are yoked, and some few ride in the coach, that such organized beurocracy is more "efficient" than allowing a more simplistic common sense approach, such as: teaching proper behavior instead of rewarding competetive, aggressive behavior as proper successful technique to 'making the buck.' Allowing, and setting priority on the basic original social/community unit 'the family' as the natural order of man.Our energy, life force, time, and resource is squandered in ignorance, called 'the way it is' and allowed to continue unabated to any noticeable degree. Things get done because people do them. Are they done better because the 'proper forms are filled and filed,' and salaries of inequitable amounts are paid to some professional succubus's known as politicians. These are our leaders? Where have they led? I may have had little choice in the normal flow of humanity that unwittingly embrace these errant philosophies, but my yes is still my own, as well as my NO! My feet, hands, voice, and choices (what there are) are mine, my responsibility, and my labor. There is no man that I will follow though I have, and will continue to walk beside those who are going the same direction. Occasionally I must stop and assist a brother or sister who has fallen or gotten lost. Occasionally that service has been done for me. When the time comes to take the lead FOR THE MOMENT THAT IT MAY BE NECESSARY, it is about responsibility, not 'stature' or 'persons.'Only one man I might have followed, but though He lived two millennia ago, to me the footsteps He left us illuminates the road that I follow, and regardless of names, nuances, and various ritual, I am confident to the core of my being that that road is the only one that leads to where we really want to go. So why pretend the dead end passages to destruction being offered STILL by the powers and principalities, are any thing but that?We choose as individuals, and delegation of that choice to another is at best foolish, and at worse...well we're getting a real good look at the possibilities.

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Comment #91 posted by FoM on June 17, 2006 at 13:42:09 PT

Had Enough
My Father was a really good man too. There isn't one job more important then being a good Mom or Dad. Happy Father's Day to all those who are Fathers.
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Comment #90 posted by Had Enough on June 17, 2006 at 13:35:34 PT

Fathers Day
Thank You FoM. He was a good man. If I could be half of what he represented, I'd be thrilled.Tomorrow is Fathers Day.

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Comment #89 posted by FoM on June 17, 2006 at 13:17:52 PT

Had Enough
Your Father was a good man. 
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Comment #88 posted by Had Enough on June 17, 2006 at 13:08:40 PT

By the way, my Father never accepted any money for his leadership. He had the position for about 10 yrs. Did not accept any pay. Within 2 yrs of accepting his position, he had 3 Fire Trucks donated to their Fire Department from left over Military Surplus. No charge. He put together a regular fire drill schedule, got others involved. Made a working and effective operation.  I’d like to see people with more of that stuff today.
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Comment #87 posted by Max Flowers on June 17, 2006 at 13:06:45 PT

I say again
Something doesn't add up here for me---they NEVER "knock and announce" on drug warrants... they basically simultaneously YELL and RAM DOWN the door. Can you all really picture them knocking on the door and saying "Police, search warrant... open the door, Mr. Jones... we have a warrant... (two minutes later) "Mr. Jones? Are you home? We have a warrant, open the door..." They do that when they have an arrest warrant for stuff like domestic problems or too many parking tickets or maybe an animal violation. So while I am all for preserving constitutional protections, on this the everyday reality versus what they're claiming is being lost don't jibe.

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Comment #86 posted by FoM on June 17, 2006 at 13:06:37 PT

Had Enough 
The guy who doesn't want it will do the best job. I agree.Politicians are suppose to work for the good of the people. They don't do that these days.
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Comment #85 posted by Had Enough on June 17, 2006 at 12:50:28 PT

Still Looking for Leaders
A good leader probably wouldn't like the job, but would do it because of obligation to mankind.My departed father, the best man I’ve ever met so far, many years ago was elected as a Fire Chief of a small volunteer fire department, he told me he didn't want the position, but because they wanted him to do it, he felt obligated, and he accepted the position. He remained Chief until we moved away from the area.That is the way I look for leaders. Been many places where someone had to take up the lead, usually the guy that doesn’t want it, does the best. Someone salivating at the mouth for position is usually a bad leader, and has other things in mind. 
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Comment #84 posted by Wayne on June 17, 2006 at 12:44:58 PT

a tragedy for everyone
Chalk another one up for America's sellouts. Our 4th amendment has just officially been sold up the river. Supporters of this ruling will say that it only applies to warranted searches, which technically is true. Unfortunately for us though, thanks to the 'Patriot' Act, they don't need warrants anymore. Police can make up a probable cause, raid your place, then produce a warrant later. They've already done it with the wiretaps. We knew this was coming.The real tragedy is not just for us citizens, but also for the police. Despite my rather liberal stance on substance use, I highly respect the law enforcement community. And it scares me to think what could happen to the decent officers that I know. If police start busting down more doors unannounced, a lot more of them are going to get their heads blown off too. Truly a shame for all of us.
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Comment #83 posted by Had Enough on June 17, 2006 at 12:37:30 PT

Signs again
Sorry George W., but Toker gets my yard sign.This is what I meant.

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Comment #82 posted by FoM on June 17, 2006 at 12:35:53 PT

Had Enough
OK, Toker00 for President. I wonder if he'd like the job? 
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Comment #81 posted by Had Enough on June 17, 2006 at 12:29:37 PT

Sorry George W. Toker gets my sign.
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Comment #80 posted by Had Enough on June 17, 2006 at 12:25:37 PT

In the House Now
Toker00 for prez. ;-)_
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Comment #79 posted by FoM on June 17, 2006 at 12:20:54 PT

Had Enough 
So very true. Looking for a leader but he's not in the house.We do need to seek him out.
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Comment #78 posted by Had Enough on June 17, 2006 at 12:13:41 PT

Looking for a Leader
We need to get ‘Back to the Garden”, before it’s gone. This includes putting real honest to God leaders in place. We need people who really want to lead, not people who want position of power and wealth. Those people abuse the honor and privilege.
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Comment #77 posted by FoM on June 17, 2006 at 12:04:41 PT

Had Enough
We have a lot of serious problems to fix. We can ignore them but not forever. Global warming was an issue in the 70s. I think we have past the point of no return and it's too late to fix. No one would listen to those hippie type ( more tree hugger type ) people back then. When I saw all the SUVs on the road I guess I knew then that it didn't matter. It will only hurt those near the ocean must be the logic.
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Comment #76 posted by Had Enough on June 17, 2006 at 11:32:19 PT

Darwin was sitting on the Levies in New Orleans, along with incompetent and corrupt leaders ranging from the Dog Catcher of New Orleans, all the way up to the Federal level. Will Darwin and his buddies be sitting on the beach soon?
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Comment #75 posted by Had Enough on June 17, 2006 at 11:18:14 PT

Playground Bully
You can take anything he says with a grain of salt. He is just one man who is stirring up a bunch of stuff.  He helps keep up the chaos; I don’t think he represents a majority of people from there. Although he has convinced some to follow his murderous venture. He is a prime example of how “The Mind can be a Terrible Thing”.My bride says he is sitting in an air conditioned palace somewhere over there laughing his ass off, living high on the hog, being serviced by his followers (brainwashed slaves).She also says the punishment for people like Saddam, and Bin Laden is that they should have to make shoes for poor children, for life. No shoe making: No food, No shelter. I think a few sand storms would help keep production up.

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Comment #74 posted by FoM on June 17, 2006 at 11:10:00 PT

Dazed and Confused
I think that society is dazed and confused right now. It really is stunning how much is happening around us and the world. We have a very important issue but as far as productive news it has become scarce. We just don't hear quality issue news anymore. Look at them tearing down the gardens in LA. Darral Hannah was involved. We have water being polluted but they'll sell us some you know. The argument about global warming isn't as important to me as how will we move people as the ocean expands which it is doing. 
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Comment #73 posted by Had Enough on June 17, 2006 at 10:54:00 PT

It hit the 70 dollar range. Don't know what the latest is. Changes every time it rains now, even a bad thunder storm, or winds that gust above 30mph, any excuse to raise it.
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Comment #72 posted by FoM on June 17, 2006 at 10:45:05 PT

Had Enough
Bin Laden in one of the first videos released after 9/11 said that oil wasn't making enough money and it should be a $100 a barrel. Well, we're on our way.
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Comment #71 posted by FoM on June 17, 2006 at 10:42:36 PT

Had Enough 
Yes I agree. It's all about money.
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Comment #70 posted by Had Enough on June 17, 2006 at 10:39:49 PT

Yes. I believe so too. When he appointed his cabinet the first time and saw it was the same as his fathers’ people, I thought this could end up being a long strange trip. Look at it now. Cannabis War is worse than ever.The secret Energy Policies for America, and the secrecy behind who attended, caught my attention immediately. Well I guess we all know now what the new Energy Policy for America was about, 3 dollars a gallon plus at the gas pumps.I would call that a redistribution of wealth.

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Comment #69 posted by FoM on June 17, 2006 at 10:28:42 PT

Had Enough 
Yes a warning would have helped. LOLSeriously about Bush he isn't the one that is pulling all the strings. I think he has been used by bigger more powerful people.
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Comment #68 posted by Had Enough on June 17, 2006 at 10:17:56 PT

Opps - FoM
I should have included a caution warning first. :)
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Comment #67 posted by FoM on June 17, 2006 at 09:58:03 PT

Had Enough 
Oh No a Vote for George sign. I just had an anxiety attack! LOL!
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Comment #66 posted by Had Enough on June 17, 2006 at 09:36:00 PT

and...I for one; appreciate anything; anyone does to help end this madness.Here’s One. If George W. Bush would whip out his mighty pen, make a few strokes with it and stop this Cannabis War (which he could do), I would put a “Vote for George” sign up. Well I'd think about it anyway. :)Believe me, I appreciate what you do, and I'm sure many others do too.

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Comment #65 posted by FoM on June 17, 2006 at 09:10:49 PT

I have never seen you grumpy. You don't come across that way to me ever. Looking at life with the rose colored glasses off is very important.
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Comment #64 posted by Toker00 on June 17, 2006 at 09:04:02 PT

Thanks guys.
Don't mind me. I'm just on a downswing and grumpy. I apologize. I've been like this for a couple weeks. It'll start an upswing soon. It always does when I MEDICATE. Or, not. It just takes longer if I don't. Sorry.Toke.
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Comment #63 posted by FoM on June 17, 2006 at 09:01:36 PT

I have heard so many times over the years how did we let this happen. No one knew what was happening unless they were in D.C. or into politics. No communication. No uniting force. The Internet really is a great help and one for at least now we can make an impact. I spent most of my adult life thinking I was different and no one thought anything like me. The Internet makes me know that many people feel like I have all these years.
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Comment #62 posted by Had Enough on June 17, 2006 at 09:00:22 PT

“Sorry so cynical. I guess I just got my feeler hurt when I think that all the time and effort I have put into "Protesting" is seen here by some as just being confrontational, violent, and unnecessary. I just wonder where our society would be now if we had not protested in the sixties? Would black people still just be seen as 3/4 human? Would women still be barefoot and pregnant? Would our children still be reciting scriptures at the front of their class every morning at school? Would sexism, rape, incest, spousal abuse, child abuse, mental illness, and rampant, blatant racism be so undercover as it was back then?Its cool Toker. I don’t think of it as being cynical. I think about these things too. Where would our society be without Freedom Fighters? Think of the Minutemen. Those guys had a bounty on their heads for their expression of freedom. Some died for it. They had to hide out and keep on the run. The battle held here with trying to reverse outdated laws has exposed some really rotten stuff. With all this going on these laws should have been changed years ago. Better yet they shouldn’t have been made to begin with. What has been uncovered in the past few years, probably has led to considerable amount of cynicism. But it’s not our country that is at fault; it’s the people with saddened intents that are the problem. And it is not just happening this country, it seems worldwide. These are ones.I see frustration. I feel it too. Many feel the same. Hang in there. The winds are changing in a favorable direction. Keep doing what you think you need to do. This will end one day.

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Comment #61 posted by whig on June 17, 2006 at 08:56:36 PT

I think maybe my perspective is colored by the fact that we have internet today.We didn't have it in the '60s. There was no place like this, a virtual space to hang out.But I'm not really awake yet today, so maybe I'll have some better ideas a little later.
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Comment #60 posted by FoM on June 17, 2006 at 08:43:26 PT

I just read about your feelings being hurt and I believe in protests. Thank God for them. Vietnam could still be going on. 
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Comment #59 posted by whig on June 17, 2006 at 08:37:53 PT

I didn't intend to disrespect you and what you've done and I'm certainly not saying it did no good because it was motivated by good intentions and it drew attention and educated a lot of people.I just think we're in a different situation now.Even war has been something good people have gone to, World War II comes to mind. It's often called the "last good war" for a reason, whether there were other choices it seemed the necessary thing at the time and there was a good cause behind it.But no one should ever be for unnecessary war.And as for me, if you don't think I'm right about something maybe I'm not, and maybe we're just in a different context.
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Comment #58 posted by FoM on June 17, 2006 at 08:35:12 PT

I tried to read the article. It's really long. I could never absorb reading a book and when articles get long I miss the point. I guess you could call me simple minded! LOL!
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Comment #57 posted by FoM on June 17, 2006 at 08:25:34 PT

You're not cynical. You have your eyes wide open.
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Comment #56 posted by Toker00 on June 17, 2006 at 08:16:36 PT

I think politicians realized the power of Religion, Children's Welfare, and Nationalism and decided to paint themselves with all three colors to camouflage the real agenda of Fascism. There is no way the power of what Hitler was able to do would just be put away somewhere and forgoten about. The industralist Elite saw something they liked, and they incorporated it into American politics. Now we have Fascism influenced Foriegn and Domestic Policies. The Republicans are the New Nazies and the Democrats can't say anything because they, too, see something they like about Fascism. Slavery works, when you CALL it WORK. And the DEA and HOMELAND SECURITY are most certainly the New Gestapo.Welcome to Neo-Nazi America. Instead of gas chambers (Which wasted a lot of LABOR), we have JOBS and PRISONS and PROHIBITION for the Elite to milk wealth from.Sorry so cynical. I guess I just got my feeler hurt when I think that all the time and effort I have put into "Protesting" is seen here by some as just being confrontational, violent, and unnecessary. I just wonder where our society would be now if we had not protested in the sixties? Would black people still just be seen as 3/4 human? Would women still be barefoot and pregnant? Would our children still be reciting scriptures at the front of their class every morning at school? Would sexism, rape, incest, spousal abuse, child abuse, mental illness, and rampant, blatant racism be so undercover as it was back then? Please. I am not being argumentative. Just tell me that SOME good came out of all the effort and blood and sweat and tears and good intentions of the people who DID confront these things, and DID bring it to the PUBLIC'S ATTENTION and it was not all in vain, nor would it be today. Please. I simply believe that if we do NOTHING, they will do EVERYTHING we fear they will.I'm through. No need to defend yourselves. You're probably right.Toke. 
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Comment #55 posted by whig on June 17, 2006 at 08:05:42 PT

I think the link I posted is still very worthwhile reading because he even discusses the core theocratic motivation for the elections being compromised. This isn't petty political corruption for the it's people who think their holy war is more important than democracy and are willing to use any dishonest and violent means necessary to win. They don't realize they are Satanic they think this is what Christianity is.Pro-War Christians are not Christians.
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Comment #54 posted by FoM on June 17, 2006 at 07:52:53 PT

Red states are pushing in on blue states like they want to run the country and that really worries me. I would feel much more secure if we had a blue country. Religious fundamentalism is what scares me. I went to a Fundamentalist Church so I am reacting from my own experience. The religion of the south is different then the religions in northern states. Religion and politics shouldn't mix but the Republicans have absorbed them and use it against people who just want to live and let live.
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Comment #53 posted by FoM on June 17, 2006 at 07:46:17 PT

Yes just like New Orleans. 
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Comment #52 posted by whig on June 17, 2006 at 07:45:09 PT

Water over the levy
Kind of like New Orleans.
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Comment #51 posted by FoM on June 17, 2006 at 07:37:52 PT

I believe Kerry won Ohio too but that now is water over the levy. Blackwell is running for Governor and is taking care of elections in Ohio this year too. I guess Blackwell will be our next governor. 
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Comment #50 posted by whig on June 17, 2006 at 07:31:22 PT

2004 election
This sums it up pretty well:
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Comment #49 posted by whig on June 17, 2006 at 07:29:24 PT

Ohio did not vote for Bush.
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Comment #48 posted by FoM on June 17, 2006 at 07:26:19 PT

I blame my state. I would be happy to say I was from a northern state but not Ohio. I love where I live because I am in the country and don't associate with local people much. I felt like I went backwards in time when we moved out here in the 70s after being raised in south eastern Pa. It was like a time warp. Why are the red state people so hung up about personal moral issues and that includes Ohio? 
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Comment #47 posted by Toker00 on June 17, 2006 at 07:13:36 PT

I didn't mean people here support Bush or the Iraq war, just that most of them vote conservative, and mainly republican. To assume that everyone here hates Kerry or the Kennedies or Democrats in general is just wrong. I wasn't refering to Texas as being Rep. so much as being conservative. There are states and cities all over the North, too, that voted rep. and conservative. Why aren't they being critisized, too? Why just the South? Are there no ignorant people in the North? Are there no Republicans or Conasevatives or SOUTERS in the north? I believe Souter would qualify as a northerner. I just meant it would be DIFFICULT to penetrate this conservative area with Hemp or Cannabis reform.People are people everywhere you go. There is no imaginary line between the North and the South where suddenly everyone turns ignorant, republican, and drunk. There are ignorant and hateful people who support Bush and the Iraq war and hate Democrats and the Kennedies in the North, too. Why blame it all on the South?Toke.
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Comment #46 posted by whig on June 16, 2006 at 20:30:22 PT

Ideally we wouldn't organize a thing, just do it. The objective as I see it is not to make it a big deal and a threat to the system but to make it a sort of regular thing and people can come and chill and it's a good time. No reason we can't do that in most public parks any given day or weekend and just kind of put the word out on the nets where it's happening.One major problem with organized protests and such is that they are a lot of work and aggravation and make the organizers very tired even if they didn't seem more like an obligation than a fun time to all the participants.We should be having fun. Hanging out with our friends. Do we really need permits for that? In a public park which exists for that very purpose? So we bring some peace signs with us. Free speech and all that. It just doesn't seem like it needs to be a big deal.I mean we can do it now and people are undoubtedly doing it, but maybe publicize a little better to say here we are and come join us if you know about this going on somewhere. And if it isn't happening, and we've got a few of us in one place that can start the ball rolling, it shouldn't require much and if it starts out small as long as you're having a good time it's still good.Put out a couple flyers and watch what happens.
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Comment #45 posted by museman on June 16, 2006 at 20:15:50 PT

whig, toker
How hard would it be to organize a passive 'rally' simultaneously in as many local public parks as possible? An event showcasing solutions as well as reiterating the obvious negative problems. Music and public discussion. Maybe a little barter and trade. I know that there is an incredible amount of red tape in some places. But those parks are ours, the people's. It could be done without being confrontational, or disrupting. In fact I submit that a series of small gatherings, for similarly linked purposes, held in our public parks could have as much, and probably wider reaching effect than everybody gathering in the thousands in one place, and doing something that draws people, not pushes them away, like music, dance, theatre, on a local live level.
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Comment #44 posted by whig on June 16, 2006 at 18:07:47 PT

I don't mind talking about this at all, and I've never been against the people who do protests but I always felt it was counterproductive to make people who might agree with you angry because you've blocked the traffic and they aren't interested in dealing with your issue right this minute because they're just trying to get home. Protests aren't just upsetting to the police they are upsetting to everyone. I know there's a good motivation there but I don't find it something I want to be part of.On the other hand I do want to hang out with nice people and having a rally (if that's what you call it) is equivalent to a party in the park with some peace signs and literature or whatever for anyone who happens to come by and wants to see what's going on, I'm down. It doesn't get in anyone's way. Anyone who is angry about that is not our friend it's someone who's trying to provoke conflict and we shouldn't give them conflict. Just peace, man.
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Comment #43 posted by FoM on June 16, 2006 at 17:22:16 PT

I always am trying to understand things. I analyze and think and wonder and there is one thing I do not understand no matter how hard I try to figure it out. This is what I just can't figure out.If people in Texas stand behind Bush after all the lies and the invasion of Iraq I really would like to know why. Everyone wants to be thought of as a good person but how can this be justified? Why do people from Texas and the south hate Democrats? I think northern democrats are nice people and are open minded and progressive. What is the real reason that southerners hate people like Kerry or the Kennedys.
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Comment #42 posted by Toker00 on June 16, 2006 at 17:07:10 PT

Gotcha whig.
More like what Museman promotes, and I agree. I still have more to discuss with you about this, if you don't mind. I understand now you are talking about rallies, and not protests. There's someone I am going to visit tonight who knows far more than I about organizing events, protests, demonstrations, etc. I haven't seen NORML do anything locally, and I want to meet with them. This is conservative Bush/DeLay country, and though their leaders are being exposed as criminals, these people are VERY set in their conservative ways, and I can understand NORML's hesitance. Haven't heard of a hemp festival or anything like that happening, either. Maybe we should all just move to California, then get Swartzenhoweveryouspellitor to put the National Guard on the California, Oregon, AND Mexican border and re-name the state CANNAFORNIA, then declare PEACE on the entire world! : ) Just kidding. (Not really)Peace.  Toke.
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Comment #41 posted by mayan on June 16, 2006 at 16:35:45 PT

This ruling will certainly put police,men,women,children and pets in harm's way.I believe the fascists are trying to provoke a domestic terrorism incident. The fascists would do it themselves but they know that most Americans are catching on to the 9/11 inside job. They just keep pushing and pushing. Martial law is their goal when the economy tanks but they need something to blame the collapse on.
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Comment #40 posted by whig on June 16, 2006 at 15:45:24 PT

I'm definitely not saying we should only talk on CNews and not have public demonstrations.I'm saying that the purpose and the audience of our demonstrations should be people like ourselves.The choir out there.My point is I don't want to be confrontational. I don't want to be shouting and making people angry at me, no matter how angry we are at them for what they are doing. I want to be peaceful. I like the idea of just having a sit-in at a park, not blocking any traffic and not disrupting anyone's business. Just folks, sitting and having some signs and maybe some music which doesn't have to be on any kind of stage, just people hanging out.Peace.A way for people to find us, like they do here on CNews, but out there in the world.
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Comment #39 posted by Toker00 on June 16, 2006 at 15:24:46 PT

Well now, Whig.
That's pretty heavy. I think I see what you mean. But by keeping it all here at Cnews, how are we reaching those who need what we do here as well? It's the people outside Cnews's/our front door who want to keep what we do here out of sight. And I think the internet is plenty public, but only for the half of Americans with computers. The "Media" have the other half of America completely in the dark for the most part. Even most people with computers don't visit us here at Cnews. Shouldn't we be putting these good understandings and the wisdom of activists who have inspired us to inspire you out there in other public outlets as well? If we wanted to stay a small group and exclude ourselves from the rest of the world, I suppose we could, but is that what we want? Don't we want everyone to understand the corruption that is destroying our nation? Don't we want everyone to understand cannbabis is not a dangerous drug, but a gift for us from whoever and whatever started this whole life experience? How can we defeat the enemy if we don't engage them? How do we make peace if we don't give the other side a reason and an explanation for it? I'm sorry, whig. I guess I'm just from the old school before computers and gadgets made life so labor free and information so quickly available. When things could be accepted at face value without worrying about what might lurk beneath the surface.   I'm sorry you have no one there in your immediate circle to share these wonderful things we run across here at Cnews with. I guess I'm just too old to be afraid anymore. I tell the guys at work what we talk about here. Not everything, but I make them very aware that our "government" is not what it seems. There have been many times I have taken articles to work and passed them around at our morning meetings. Some of the guys get a kick out of them, and take them seriously, and the others just smile and offer no comment. I don't push it, but I don't stay quiet. Most of the guys are my age, so they've been through all the sixties and seventies things, and though they are straight and set in their ways, they wish us luck in our movement, and they are serious.Cnews is like a warehouse. People come here to stock up on humanity and wisdom, then distribute it to their local folks. Having said all this, I have to say that everything you say makes sense to me. You are young and way ahead of me intellectually. I tell you something. You teach as well as learn here, whig. Your outlook is remarkable and you take what we give you here and expand and improve on it. Keep doing what you do.Wage peace on war. END CANNABIS PROHIBITION NOW!
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Comment #38 posted by whig on June 16, 2006 at 14:09:27 PT

Music for Toker00 you can play Ogg Vorbis. Let me know if you need help.
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Comment #37 posted by whig on June 16, 2006 at 13:39:39 PT

"My answer is neither. You are aware of the problems we face, you would be the choir. The police are interested in keeping these "riots" from happening."What we are doing here on CNews all the time is preaching to the choir. That's the best group of people in the world to preach to. Because we preach to one another and we help one another to understand what we're doing and what's going on and maybe even how to do things better. I've learned so much here. I've been educated by people with far more experience and understanding of the situation than me. I'm just a newbie. I've been a pothead for barely more than a couple years. I'm a young'in and I started late besides.You'all preach to me. You tell me what you see. You tell me I'm among friends and I can testify to my own experience and you all listen and tell me when I'm making sense. I can't do that with the people on the outside who don't have a clue. I can't tell them what I know much less what I do unless I know them well, and I don't want to have to tell people what I do when I can't invite them to join me and I don't have any means to provide that. When I do it's so little and I have no group that I am comfortable with here in Pittsburgh now. That will change in Berkeley no doubt but for here and for now there is my CNews family and it is here I spend much of my time when I'm just wanting to talk.My point is that we are the choir that needs to be preached to and we are all over the world and we are in every city and place but we are not all on CNews and we don't all hear the validation and understanding of others. We need to preach to the choir because we want to wake them up, to let them know we exist and we are their family.This is a demonstration I can get behind, one that says we are trying to reach the people who need help, who want to be with friends, who believe in peace and who love one another but for they could meet nice folks that aren't part of the whole rat-race.We're here and we're not visible because it is too dangerous to expose ourselves in person and say what we do. But we can say other things that we know people will hear and that cannot be silenced so easily. We can say peace and we can say end the war but we can tell people about ourselves in a more private way when they have joined us.This isn't an organization it is just people hanging out together, and we are doing it here on CNews right now. We can do it in any place where any few of us can get together and talk and join a circle of friends.I know I'm not describing anything new at all. This is going on all over and I just haven't found it yet. Because what I'm not interested in doing is talking to the government. I don't want to challenge the police. I don't want to make them see us as a threat because I don't want to have that kind of a war. I want peace. I want people to just do their things and not hurt others. And the best way to get that is to just do that. Just join those people and do those things. A public demonstration is just a way of saying, hey.That's my take and I'm fully in my upright and locked position so I think I'm not confused about my own perspective.
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Comment #36 posted by OverwhelmSam on June 16, 2006 at 13:32:57 PT

Law Enforcement Will Appreciate This Ruling
Law enforcement and prosecutors think that as long as something is legal, it's okay to do it no matter how evil it is. Rulings like this help them feel better about how cruel they are toward their own people. Just because something is legal, does not make it right, ethical and moral. By the same token, just because something is illegal, it does not make it wrong, unethical or immoral.
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Comment #35 posted by museman on June 16, 2006 at 12:23:58 PT

irony, hipocrisy, and law
The irony is that all (western) law is based on the "First Precedent" which is the belief in the supremity and existence of "God." That God is the Judaic and Christian God of Moses, Elijah, and Y'shua. The law is originally based on the 'ten' commandments as given to Moses. or "Mosaic Law." The interepretive result that our nations fathers came up with known as the "Constitution" is a fundamentally Christian document albeit constructed with an aim at acceptance, and inclusion of all "Faiths, and Religions"There are 2 formats of law represented in the religion which is held to be our "National Religion" by the power elite, who delite in using the ancient double-think of the Church (exemplified, and employed during the various 'inquisitions' of the Roman Catholic Church prior to and throughout the Renaissance) to 'prove and justify' their power, station, authority, and propriety.#1. Mosaic Law- rounded down to a general axiom; "An eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth." The entirety of that fundament of law has become an integral part of the current enforced, and violently expressed belief as "justice."#2. The Law of Love, Y'shuas law, the completion and fulfillment of supposedly the 'precedent' upon which 'christianity' is supposedly based. All of His teaching and examples, though repeated 'word for word' every sunday for the last 2,000 years, have yet to gain purchase in the actual reality we live in. Y'shuas answer to this travesty is "Judge not lest you be judged." Further elaborated upon by this; "How can you say to your brother, 'Brother, let me take that splinter out of your eye,' when all the while you yourself do not see the beam in your own eye? Vain pretender! take the beam out of your own eye first, and then you will see clearly to take the splinter out of your brother's eye." No application in modern law, therefore those who claim to be 'following Christ' (at least in this instance of interpreting law) are not in fact anywhere near the core of the real faith, and manifest as hipocrits.The 'supreme court' was appointed by an administration that repeatedly lays claims to it's 'divine appointment' and 'christian faith.'The Bible says that 'No man serves 2 masters." I submit that the religion these pretenders, posers, usurpers, and renderers of violence, destruction, war, and death actually serve is neither the God of Moses, nor the Father of Y'shua, but the ancient god moloch, and the icons of Babylon.The Law of God is rooted in mankinds inherent abilty to posess common sense and reason. The law of man sometimes crosses that more sane route, but more often than not it is hi-jacked into the same damn hands at every turn. Those who posess the luxury of ancient knowledge, and the 'fraternity' of 'brotherhoods' like skull and bones, the bohemian grovers, and numerous other named 'secret societies' have always had an advantage over most of us who are born without a clue, and find that such information as this is closely guarded, and not available to the general public.Law is a covenant between God and man. The RULE of law is an invented, constructed, medium for waging war on the struggling children of God, many of whom like to partake of the Sacred Herb. The RULE of law is errant, corrupt, and like unto a bucket of lies resembling the drop of truth that is buried underneath. As long as humanity is willing to abdicate their God-given Sovereignty of life and being (the 'inalienable rights' and 'pursuit of happiness' briefly mentioned in the constitution) to such false authorities as present and exemplified in the Supreme Court (in itself the name is an insult to the Power and Authority of God) then we will have thugs breaking down our doors in the 'Name of' the state, the king, or "The Law."
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Comment #34 posted by whig on June 16, 2006 at 12:10:12 PT

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Comment #33 posted by runderwo on June 16, 2006 at 09:57:00 PT

***Franklin County legislators are set to approve a local law allowing police to seize and auction the vehicles of convicted --drug dealers and traffickers--. Using a legal mechanism called forfeiture, law enforcement agencies in the county could impound vehicles used to traffic or distribute illicit drugs following at least a misdemeanor conviction of a --drug-related offense--.OK, so the law is INTENDED to allow police to seize vehicles of drug dealers and traffickers. However, the law ALLOWS police to seize vehicles of those following a misdemeanor conviction of a drug-related offense. How much do you want to bet that there is NO actual constraint that the vehicle be "used to traffic or distribute illicit drugs"?Of course, even without reasonable boundaries written into the law, we know the police will only use the law as INTENDED and not as they are ALLOWED to. Right?
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Comment #32 posted by Max Flowers on June 16, 2006 at 09:42:08 PT

Knocking? Are they kidding?
I'm as unhappy as anyone about this court decision, but also a little confused. I have never seen cops knock when they have a search warrant in a drug case. They yell "Police! Search warrant!" at the same time as the guy with the battering ram swings back and two seconds later, boom, in flies the door. So I don't see how this changes what has already been standard operating procedure for years. I think it has been 25 years or more since cops didn't feel free to bash the door down in seconds. Knocking is what they do when they DON'T have a warrant!
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Comment #31 posted by FoM on June 16, 2006 at 09:09:01 PT

New York: Turning Back The Clock Again
Drug Property Seizure Law Revised, as Per Legislature ***By Jacob Resneck, Enterprise Staff WriterFriday, June 16, 2006 MALONE — Franklin County legislators are set to approve a local law allowing police to seize and auction the vehicles of convicted drug dealers and traffickers. Using a legal mechanism called forfeiture, law enforcement agencies in the county could impound vehicles used to traffic or distribute illicit drugs following at least a misdemeanor conviction of a drug-related offense. 
Complete Article:
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Comment #30 posted by FoM on June 16, 2006 at 09:03:56 PT

Thank you for telling us how you feel about the war in Iraq.
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Comment #29 posted by rchandar on June 16, 2006 at 08:33:17 PT:

Several reasons why we should leave Iraq
1. Because I couldn't give a F#$k less about Iraq.
2. Because millions of Africans are starving and dying of AIDS and genocide; Iraqis eat and drive cars.
3. They're an inconsequential little Arab country.
4. I can think of 2,500 really good reasons, but they're all dead now.
5. Oh, those Iraqis, those poor little Iraqis need democracy--who gives a flying f#$k?
6. Because other people in the world languish under dictatorships and genocide, and enough's enough.
7. Because Bush is a stupid idiot who was pursuing a family grudge.
8. $94 billion? Really?
9. Because we haven't moved democracy forward even one milimeter. Have we opened any schools? Started any businesses?
10. Like I said, I don't give a f#$k.
11. 2,500 dead soldiers.
12. 2,500 crying mothers who'll never get their sons back.
13. No weapons of mass destruction.
14. Because Pakistan is a much bigger hotbed of terrorism than Iraq will ever be.
15. We can buy oil from Iran.
16. I'm an Indian. The Muslims invaded our country, enslaved our people, destroyed our temples, raped our women, lived it up, and made us poor. And no one cried a single f#$king tear for us then, or now.17. So like I said, I don't give a flying f#$k.
18. And neither should you.--rchandar
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Comment #28 posted by MikeEEEEE on June 16, 2006 at 08:31:13 PT

History can tell us
The US has a long history of prejudice. And the writers of the original constitution knew how screwed up things could get when religion is mixed with govt.If I fly the American flag again, it will be the original, inspired by the great people who founded this country, not what we have today.
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Comment #27 posted by rchandar on June 16, 2006 at 05:28:50 PT:

Yes, you are right. After all, the "right to bear arms" is still constitutional, and 150 million of us have firearms. Cops will die, how sad.But I'm reminded most of Gandhi's first protest organization in South Africa, when Indians were required to carry passes and show them whenever the police asked for them. Gandhi says that they can ask for them at home, in front of family:"Understand, he need not knock. He may enter." We Indians, family people, take privacy very, very seriously. What irks me most is the fact that the mainstream media carries with it not even a hint of how evil and misguided this all is; they think they're catching criminals, and that's all there is to it. Shame, shame, shame...--rchandar
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Comment #26 posted by gloovins on June 16, 2006 at 04:32:41 PT

excellent analogy w/ Gestapo....brilliant but I'm so sad how it really actually IS worse than those evil nazi's ... so sad
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Comment #25 posted by billos on June 16, 2006 at 04:24:14 PT

            Statistice DO show
that the cops get the wrong address much too often. A no-knock at the wrong address will yeild a dead cop(s).
I would think the cops WANT to announce themselves. However I do notice how arrogant, MILITANT, and condenscending many have become the past few years.Maybe soon we could witness a no knock on the TV show cops. Then we could watch the bullets fly until the camera filming the incident gets shattered by one the instant before it hits the poor camerman's face. How exciting!?!! The ratings will soor!!!!
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Comment #24 posted by whig on June 16, 2006 at 00:21:51 PT

Guantanamo Bay is a concentration camp.There are more planned.
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Comment #23 posted by observer on June 15, 2006 at 23:35:11 PT

The Gestapo at least knocked...
The Nazis don't have nothin' on these bozos. The Nazis had to knock at least. The U.S. fascist police state out Nazis the Nazis, once again.
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Comment #22 posted by whig on June 15, 2006 at 22:25:34 PT

No-knock entry.More police shot.How better a way to make this a shooting war?The war on drugs is planned to get worse.Drug dealing will become a death penalty offense.
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Comment #21 posted by Patrick on June 15, 2006 at 22:22:22 PT

If the Supreme Court reasoning for this is to preserve drug evidence then the dissenters are correct in that 90 years of precedent has been changed. Now the pursuit of forensic evidence by the government supercedes the pursuit of our happiness and security in our own homes. What next?

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Comment #20 posted by MikeEEEEE on June 15, 2006 at 19:30:27 PT

The Great Experiment
The original constitution was an experiment.With no-knocks (breaking in without a warning) more police will be shot. Can you imagine the law suits?
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Comment #19 posted by Patrick on June 15, 2006 at 18:50:47 PT

From another thread
I agree with Toker00Do you smoke pot? Oh, yeah. Is it important to you? Yes, it is. Why? Because I hate Prozac and I can’t function on mushrooms.Because I hate alcohol and I can't function on pharmaceuticals.Here’s another….Because I hate ignorance and I can’t function in a police state.Obviously the Justice Department is out of balance to the will of the people. I would suspect that 69% or more of Americans if polled with the right phrasing of the question; should the POLICE knock before entering? They would respond in the affirmative. This decision is the same as allowing law enforcement to SHOOT then yell FREEZE! 

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Comment #18 posted by mayan on June 15, 2006 at 17:50:39 PT

The Gestapo
I'm sure they're overjoyed. The Constitution was great while it lasted.
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Comment #17 posted by charmed quark on June 15, 2006 at 16:49:06 PT

Drug war and constitution
So many restrictions on "constitutional rights" have been made because of the drug war. The original "no-knock warrants" were allowed to prevent people from flushing drug evidence before the police got in. There have been many deaths when innocent home owners try to defend themselves from heavily armed hooded men wearing black breaking into their homes unannounced. At least the no-knocks were suppose to be restricted. Now it's going to be a free-for-all.I fear that the "war on terror" will result in similar laws.
Maybe "They" will switch the focus from using the war on drugs to oppress people and use the war on terror for that purpose.
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Comment #16 posted by Toker00 on June 15, 2006 at 16:16:40 PT

The rest.
Friday, June 23 - Sunday, June 25The annual grassroots organizing meeting called the Southern Girls 
Convention is in Houston this year. It attracts activists from across 
country for discussion, action, and entertainment devoted to building a 
feminist community in the South and promoting social justice. 
share ideas and skills, discuss important issues, organize campaigns, 
have fun as a community. Past workshop topics at SGC have included 
fatphobia, abortion rights and access, radical parenting, "100 Years of 
Revolutionary Wimmin," the criminalization of women, "Queer and Trans 
in the South," gender bias in schools, sexism in the activist community 
roles and strategies for boys in the struggle against male supremacy. 
There's been skill-sharing on radical cheerleading, community access 
television, gun safety and self-defense, workplace union organizing, 
printing, sexercises, Internet organizing, and how to start a 
consciousness-raising group. There'll also be an arts and craft fair, 
nightly music shows, and display tables for participants and 
Childcare will be available at the convention space. Visit for more details and to 
(please note that the banner on the home page says 2005, but it really 
2006).Saturday, June 24Pride Week culminates with the annual festival and parade. The festival 
starts at 2 p.m. at Westheimer near Montrose. There'll be continuous 
entertainment on two stages. Headline artists are Taylor Dayne, Casey 
Stratton, KJ Denhert, and Dylan Rice. There’ll be more than 40 booths 
by local non-profit organizations; food, drink, and merchandise 
vendors; a 
GLBT History Tent; a mechanical bull, and much more. The festival runs 
8 p.m. Tickets are $10. $25 gets admission to the bleachers for the 
Parade, which starts at 8:45. For all the events of Pride Week, visit, June 24 - Saturday, July 1Humanitarian Aid Drive for Cuba. Join the collection of materials that 
17th Pastors for Peace Friendshipment Caravan will deliver to Cuba. For 
40 years, the people of Cuba have been the victims of the U.S. 
embargo, which causes shortages of food, medicine, and other important 
supplies. Items wanted: medicines, vitamins, painkillers and 
(expiration dates no earlier than February 1, 2007); reading glasses, 
walking canes, and wheel chairs; school supplies, backpacks, and 
(in Spanish and in very good condition); construction and auto 
tools; unused blankets and linens in their original wraps; infant 
and dietary supplements (no other food). Cash is always welcome (make 
to Pastors for Peace). Donations can be dropped off at Shrine of the 
Madonna, 5309 Martin L. King Blvd.; SHAPE Center, 3815 Live Oak at 
First Unitarian Universalist Church, 5200 Fannin; KPFT, 419 Lovett. If 
uncertain about an acceptable donation, call Melissa Patrick, 
[See July 1 for caravan arrival.]Tuesday, June 27Execution vigil for Angel Resendiz (see under REGULAR VIGILS for time 
place).Saturday, July 1Meet & Greet the Caravanistas! All those donations will be presented to 
Peace Friendshipment Caravan when it comes through Houston this day. 
Donations will still be acceptable. Also bring a covered dish. Or just 
let the caravanistas know Houston supports them in their journey. 3-7 
at St. Dominic Center, 2403 Holcombe Blvd, For more information, call 
Rubac, 713/503-2633 or Gordon Anderson, 832/860-6464.Monday, July 17 - Friday, July 21Once again, the highly successful Houston Peace Camp, a day camp for 
graders, will be held. "Peacemakers" will be the theme this year. 
be arts and crafts, puppets, drama, non-competitive games, yoga, and 
activities, plus special guests speaking on topics to broaden the 
world. Enrollment is still open. Cost is $100, but some partial and 
scholarships are available. Location is the Cameron Retreat Center, 
Holcombe Blvd. Sponsored by The Women's International League of Peace 
Freedom. For more information and to enroll, call 713/726-1266 or 
713/863-8708.Sunday, August 13The second annual Peak Oil Conference, a name referring to the period 
experts think we will shortly be in (if we aren’t already in it), when 
annual amount of oil extracted from the earth will peak, then fall off 
succeeding years. Experts and attendees will discuss the impact on our 
oil-dependent economy. 1-5 p.m. at First Unitarian Universalist Church, 
Fannin.Sunday, September 24 – Sunday, October 1The annual celebration of Gandhi Week, sponsored by the Mahatma Gandhi 
Library and over 50 local organizations. As in previous years, there'll 
many and varied activities. There’ll be a culminating celebration 
October 1 
at 7 p.m. called 1000 Lights for Peace. It will be a cultural program 
candle lighting ceremony on the steps of City Hall, featuring an 
address by 
Mayor Bill White and preceded by a torch relay from the Gandhi Statue 
Herman Park to City Hall. For more information about Gandhi Week 
including the city-wide speech contest, over the next few months keep 
checking, November 3Houston Peace and Justice Center (HPJC) will hold its fourth annual 
Dinner. National Peacemaker honoree and keynote speaker will be Roy 
Bourgeois, M.M., founder and guiding spirit of School of the Americas 
Watch.Saturday, November 4HPJC will hold a conference entitled "The New Political Reality in 
America: An examination of its nature, origins, and implications." In 
years, national elections in South America have brought left-of-center 
administrations to power in several of the most important nations of 
continent, including those in the Southern Cone, Bolivia, and 
HPJC believes that this phenomenon may have major political, economic, 
social consequences for the hemisphere, including for the United 
Yet, to date there has been no public examination of the phenomenon in 
geographic area. Roy Bourgeois will be the keynote speaker. He'll be 
by experts from Houston’s academic and civic communities.A few suggestions for saving energy and decreasing pollution:• When you go on extended trips, reset your water heater to "pilot" on 
heaters or a similar low setting on electric ones.
• Replace incandescent light bulbs with screw-in florescent bulbs. The 
savings in energy and longevity more than amortize the higher initial 
• Change your AC filters no less frequently than once a month.
• Recycle at curbside; don't make frequent trips to a recycling center 
may use more gasoline than the recycling conserves.
• Consider selecting Green Mountain Energy Company as your electric 
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Comment #15 posted by Toker00 on June 15, 2006 at 16:15:47 PT

It's not all about protests, either.
Here is a group who is present at a lot of our protests/rallies. I just wanted to post this to show you all that we do more than just drink beer and ride bulls down here in Texas. This is a list of speakers, and gatherings this year in HOUSTON. Some, I may attend.HOUSTON PEACE AND JUSTICE CENTER'S TWICE-MONTHLY PROGRESSIVE CALENDARHold the dates! There are three major events already posted for the 
fall in 
this calendar. Their sponsors hope you will work to make sure the 
organizations to which you belong do not schedule events on those 
Avoiding conflicts that impede the effectiveness of Houston’s 
communities of 
conscience is a major goal of the Houston Peace and Justice Center.Submit your event notices to hpjc-calendar-owner bi-weekly calendar transmissions supplement HPJC's web site 
Organizational meetings are posted in the Calendar section of the HPJC 
website ( and printed on the back page of the Houston 
News. Use this calendar to avoid scheduling conflicts. Transmit it to 
on your e-mail list(s) who would benefit from the information. Also, 
publicize your events through this transmission, the HPJC website, 
on-line calendar, and Houston Peace News (hpn_cal; submission 
deadline the 21st of each month).Unless otherwise noted, all the listed events are free and open to the 
public.FREEWAY BLOGGINGEvery Tuesday evening from 5:30 to 7 p.m. anti-war and impeachment 
are holding up signs on the Dunlavy Bridge over Highway 59 in Houston. 
There’s a huge amount of slow-moving rush hour traffic then. People are 
welcome to bring the issues and signs they wish.REGULAR VIGILSDeath watch vigils. These are held from 5:30-6:20 p.m. on the day of 
state execution. Remaining June dates: 20th (Lamont Reese), 27th (Angel 
Resendez). This month the vigils are being held by First Unitarian 
Universalist Church, 5200 Fannin. Call before you come out to learn if 
has been a stay. Contact Burnham Terrell, 713/921-0948, 
burnhamterrell observance. The Social Justice Committee of St. Bernadette 
says a rosary at 7 p.m. at its grotto on the day of each state 
The church is located at 15500 El Camino Real.Weekday sunrise vigil for peace. Live Oak Friends Meeting continues 
vigil beginning half hour before sunrise at its meeting house, 1318 W. 
St.Second Saturday walking meditation for peace sponsored by the 
Department of 
Peace Campaign-Houston Chapter. Participants will walk 20-30 minutes, 
then enjoy a simple tea ceremony. Location varies. For more 
call Carondelet Dember, 713/522-7279.EVENTSThursday, June 15An "Open Dialog on Education" organized by The Real School a.k.a. 
Valley. Join a conversation about what the real goals of our 
institutions should be. Do existing schools focus on control and 
at the expense of critical thinking and independent decision-making? 
Can the 
unique creativity of each child be fostered in a school setting? 7-9 
p.m. at 
The Artery, 5401 Jackson. For more information, contact Krini Stowe, 
713/201-6704.Sunday, June 18In anticipation of Pride Week 2006, the Interfaith Alliance for 
Inclusiveness will host the annual Houston GLBT Pride Interfaith 
Service. The ceremony will include the liturgy and music of numerous 
communities, including Christians, Jews, Muslims, Buddhists, Unitarian 
Universalists, and Hindus. Former Bering associate minister Rev. Troy 
Plummer will be the keynote speaker. Since November 2003, Rev. Plummer 
served as the executive director of the Reconciling Ministries Network. 
p.m. at Bering United Methodist Church, 1440 Harold Ave. For more 
information, contact Burton Bagby, 713/721-0202, cbbagby, June 19Houston's National Emancipation Association will help the city 
Juneteenth with live music and a free family barbecue in Hermann Park. 
Juneteenth marks the day in 1865 that U.S. Major General Gordon Granger 
it down to Galveston to inform the Texas slaves of their freedom—a full 
years after President Abraham Lincoln had issued the Emancipation 
Proclamation. Programming includes young up-and-coming performers in a 
talent extravaganza, live blues, jazz and gospel groups, and a surprise 
act. Miller Outdoor Theatre in Hermann Park. For more information, call 
713/529-4195.Monday, June 19Greg Palast, investigative journalist and author of the New York Times 
bestseller, "The Best Democracy Money Can Buy," will speak in Houston 
the auspices of KPFT. He is best known as the journalist who, for the 
Observer (UK), broke the story of how Jeb Bush purged thousands of 
Black citizens from voter rolls before the 2000 election, thereby 
the White House to his brother George. His reports on the theft of the 
election, the spike of the FBI investigations of the bin Ladens before 
September 11, and the secret State Department documents planning the 
of Iraq's oil fields have won him a record six "Project Censored" 
$10 for KPFT members; $15 for non-members. $100 sponsors get reserved 
seating, a copy of Palast's new book "Armed Madhouse," and light 
refreshments at the meet-and-greet reception. 5:30 p.m. reception (cash 
bar), 7 p.m. program at the River Oaks Theater, 2009 West Gray. For 
information and to purchase tickets on-line, visit, June 20Execution vigil for Lamont Reese (see under REGULAR VIGILS for time 
place).Tuesday, June 20RESULTS, a grassroots citizens lobby working to end hunger and the 
aspects of poverty, is holding an advocacy training. Skills covered 
will be 
organizing community events, generating media coverage, writing to and 
lobbying elected officials, and forming coalitions. Meredith Dodson, 
RESULTS’ Director of Domestic Campaigns in D.C., will give an update on 
pertinent bills pending in Congress. Light snacks provided. 6-8 p.m. at 
University Presbyterian Church, 3601 Blodgett. For more information, 
Kathleen Duncan, 832-971-7553, kndroses, June 21The Socially Responsible Investing Network will have two speakers at 
upcoming meeting. Ken Crimmins, a broker, will speak about, a 
biodeisel startup company in Conroe, as well as socially responsible 
investing generally. Also, Helen Shoup will talk more about "What is a 
Solari Circle?" According to Solari (visit, building 
means not just earning money, but also improving the trust in society, 
protecting our environment, etc. 7 p.m. at First Unitarian Universalist 
Church, 5200 Fannin in an upstairs classroom. For more information, 
713/842-6643.Thursday, June 22The Texas Freedom Network continued its Speaker Series in Houston with 
talk by Chris Mooney, author of "The Republican War on Science." In the 
book, Mooney documents the Bush Administration's increasing 
unwillingness to 
distinguish between legitimate research and ideologically driven 
pseudoscience. The Texas Freedom Network champions human rights with a 
special focus on combating the intolerance of the Religious Right. 7 
p.m. at 
Emerson Unitarian Church, 1900 Bering Dr.
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Comment #14 posted by Toker00 on June 15, 2006 at 15:51:00 PT

My answer is neither. You are aware of the problems we face, you would be the choir. The police are interested in keeping these "riots" from happening. The police departments know well in advance whether a permit to either march or gather in a centralized area of protest has been issued. They are aware of what groups are taking part, and what issue is being protested. I have NEVER seen a cop during any of our protests, provoke the crowd. They do the work of setting up barriers so we can have a clear road, or sidewalk, to walk on. And you are correct about the anarchists.The people we try to reach are the ones driving past, the ones in the stores and offices we pass on our way to City Hall. We do not target the Police Department. We speak directly to the City officials themselves. Few, and many times none, come out to discuss the issue with us in public, but it does happen. Some lower level officials even join the protest. We speak and chant and hold hands and laugh and dance and sing and shout in the spirit of freedom, and get really, really, tired and thirsty, but we prepare for that when we reach our destination, be it City Hall or a Public Park. It is an absolute labor of LOVE. Ask Cindy Crawford.I love ya bro., and I WANT you to understand. Toke. 
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Comment #13 posted by whig on June 15, 2006 at 15:28:03 PT

Here's what I think. Demonstrating peacefully can be very effective if the target audience is people like ourselves. To let others know we're here and we're willing to stand with one another.But I also know that demonstrations are often targeted to the police, and that is where "anarchists" get a bad name but there is nothing wrong with peaceful anarchism which does not provoke or engage in violence against people or property.Saying we have "security" to deal with problems does not always take into consideration well-organized disruption. Police riots. Agent provocateurs. Collusion between the two. Anything that can give an excuse for violence can quickly spiral.So my question for you is this: Who are you speaking to with your street protest? Are you speaking to me and those like me, are you speaking to the police? If you are speaking to me, what do you want to tell me? If you are speaking to the police, what do you want to tell them?I'm not asking this to disagree, but to understand, and to say whether I would agree depends on understanding first.I will not agree with violence, advocation or provocation.
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Comment #12 posted by Toker00 on June 15, 2006 at 15:07:34 PT

Taking it to the streets does NOT mean violence. It means getting people to gather and express, in public, their outrage at unjust laws in a supposedly FREE nation. It's called making an attempt at TAKING our FREEDOM back. The only violence usually comes from the cops, if PROVOKED. If permits are issued, and protesters remember their etiquette, and security volunteers are trained in what to look for and what to do in the event of trouble from outside counter protesters, and even trouble from their own people, things RARELY, if EVER get out of hand. Anarchists present more problems than any other groups. But it's not like it's a free for all and everyone winds up decking someone. That's ridiculous to think that. I'm not saying you do think that, now whig, but I would like for you to know that few protests wind up with anything other than tired people from all the shouting and walking. But, it is an impressive sight, and a grand feeling to be a part of a group of AMERICANS (peacefully) fighting for what is RIGHT. I guess it depends on your personality. It can be exciting to some, and intimidating to others. It's a risk many more of us should be willing to take. Just MHO.Toke.
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Comment #11 posted by whig on June 15, 2006 at 14:20:47 PT

No violence.None.
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Comment #10 posted by OverwhelmSam on June 15, 2006 at 14:10:01 PT

Time To Take It To The Streets
Well, it's obvious that the Courts are not going to uphold our rights under the constitution. Time to start busting and firing law enforcement officers and politicians who abuse their positions. To every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction. 
[ Post Comment ]


Comment #9 posted by FoM on June 15, 2006 at 13:54:06 PT

I agree with you.
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Comment #8 posted by rchandar on June 15, 2006 at 13:48:00 PT:

What a disgusting, shameful day for our "democracy." 
[ Post Comment ]


Comment #7 posted by whig on June 15, 2006 at 12:55:22 PT

OT: Pentagon talking points on Iraq
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Comment #6 posted by Sam Adams on June 15, 2006 at 12:50:08 PT

You haven't been keeping up on the news. Strip searches are old, old, news.Here in Massachusetts there was a big scandal a few years back because the local police/jail had strip-searched (incl. digital rape "cavity searches") over 1,500 women accused of petty crimes - everything from DUI to unpaid parking tickets, other petty stuff. They had a special process set up where the strip searches would be done in front of a big glass window, with multiple pigs watching from the other side.Some of the women started a class-action lawsuit and won big bucks from...the taxpayers!  But this went on for years, with the media barely taking notice at all. Even when the lawsuit and settlement were announced, I only saw the news buried in the local section of the big newspapers.Look at the way the media always portrays these decisions that reduce civil rights. It's ALWAYS a drug case - it has been for 30+ years. However, there is always only a cursory mention of the drug issue in the media. What I'm saying is that all these decisions could have been presented as "American government uses War on Drugs to take away civil rights".  That's one bias. Another one is that we regular American citizens, all 275 million of us, seem to be at the bottom of the "liberal" media's priority list. Look at the hoopla over immigrant rights, Muslim rights, Gitmo abuses, torture in Baghdad, etc. Abuses of Palestinians. They're on the front page, literally every day, and several more pages in the front section of the newspapers.These Supreme Court decisions that directly affect all of us are usually 1-and-out articles, never mentioned again. Never cumulatively analyzed. Think about it - how many articles have you seen on Israel and the Palenstinians? Abu Gharaib? How many have you seen, TOTAL, in the last 20 years, on civil rights and the Supreme Court? Less than I see on Palestine in one week.

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Comment #5 posted by FoM on June 15, 2006 at 12:02:11 PT

A conservative to me is a person or political party that wants laws on all personal moral issues so that everyone becomes conservative.
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Comment #4 posted by dongenero on June 15, 2006 at 11:48:45 PT

I find it baffling that conservatives support this kind of thing. I always thought they were ideologically opposed to these kind of big government, power grabs. 
[ Post Comment ]


Comment #3 posted by freewillks on June 15, 2006 at 11:27:48 PT

Innocent until proven guilty?
Not any more. This is a sad day for our founding fathers. Whats next, male cops strip and cavity searching 14 year old girls becouse they "feel that they may lose evidence"? 
[ Post Comment ]


Comment #2 posted by dongenero on June 15, 2006 at 11:19:51 PT

activist judges
Right wing...........activist judges, that is.Move us deeper and deeper into a police state.
[ Post Comment ]


Comment #1 posted by FoM on June 15, 2006 at 10:43:23 PT

Clocks Are Running Backwards
This administration has really hurt our country. 
[ Post Comment ]

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