cannabisnews.com: Pot Growers Are New Target in War on Terror










  Pot Growers Are New Target in War on Terror

Posted by CN Staff on August 29, 2007 at 05:23:25 PT
By Scott Thill, AlterNet 
Source: AlterNet 

USA -- Last time we checked in on the bizarro nexus between cannabis and terrorism, it was none other than actor/director Tommy Chong who was feeling the Bush administration's post-9/11 wrath. In fact, the stoner icon, whose fabled act was concurrently resuscitated for Fox's drugged and confused comedy hit That 70s Show, was being slapped by John Ashcroft with a nine-month prison bid, a $20,000 fine and over $100,000 in seized assets for selling bongs. The terrorism connection? He was sentenced on Sept. 11, 2003. And if you think that's a specious connection, it's only gotten worse since. In fact, over the last few years, "terrorist" has become an epithet for all seasons.
In 2003, Iraq occupation architect Richard Perle slapped investigative journalist Seymour Hersh with the term, saying, "Look, Sy Hersh is the closest thing American journalism has to a terrorist, frankly." As if filing a story about the doomed occupation of a sovereign state in the pages of the New Yorker was the same thing as flying a 747 into the World Trade Center.In 2004, Secretary of Education Rod Paige called the National Education Association, the country's largest teachers union, "a terrorist organization" because of what Paige defined as the "obstructionist scare tactics" used by its lobbyists. Because we all know it's every educator's dream to buck the systemby blowing themselves up in front of their students.And just this month, the Bush administration decided to employ the term to legally target the entire Iranian Revolutionary Guard, a sovereign nation's standing army numbering in the hundreds of thousands. When you want a war that badly, you'll pretty much do or say anything to get it.So how does the Bush administration get away with crying terrorist at every opportunity? Say hello to the Military Commissions Act. Thanks to this 2006 piece of legislation, terrorism has become the basis of American foreign and domestic policy. Yes, the term has become equivalent to everything from ideologically driven violence to petty theft, and can be used to incarcerate, exterminate or character assassinate anything in sight.It's no wonder then that federal officials are now revisiting their previously failed effort to link terrorism to cannabis, the only real cash cow in the government's so-called War on Drugs. Only difference is, this time, they don't have Tommy Chong as a scapegoat.Unable or unwilling to solve the nation's crippling meth addiction or its hypocritical dependency on prescribed narcotics like oxycontin, the Office of National Drug Control Policy (ONDCP) recently rang the terrorism alarm to nail pot growers in Redding's Shasta-Trinity National Forest in California. Along the way, ONDCP "czar" John Walters showed off not only the Bush administration's love of twisted terminology but also its subcultural savvy by coining a memorable phrase of his own."We have kind of a reefer blindness," Walters explained during a Redding press conference on the ONDCP's Operation Alesia, a cannabis-eradication program coordinated by the California National Guard's Counterdrug Taskforce and the Shasta County Sheriff's Office. Walters followed that clever turn of phrase with the reliable terrorist designation to describe the armed growers cultivating cannabis in Shasta County. "These people are armed; they're dangerous. [They're] violent criminal terrorists." He even went so far to argue that the "terrorists" growing weed in Shasta County, as the Redding Record Searchlight reported, "wouldn't hesitate to help other terrorists get into the country with the aim of causing mass casualties."Except there seem to be a couple major problems with Walters' characterizations. For one, Walters declined to explain during the press conference what Operation Alesia's specific goals were. More importantly, he didn't offer up any concrete names of the terrorists or their ideological objectives. What legalization advocates and law enforcement authorities alike were left with was yet another hazy strategy based on loose terminology whose only purpose it seems is to confiscate as much pot as possible from Shasta County's public lands.A noble pursuit to be sure, but counterterrorism? Hardly.Especially when rural Shasta County's biggest problem is meth, not marijuana, addiction. Further, Walters' coded terminology, when unmasked, is not employed to raise awareness of al Qaeda's grand cannabis cultivation strategy to destabilize the American government, but rather to inflame regional biases against, you guessed it, Mexicans. Especially the undocumented variety, who are "the other terrorists" Walters mentioned looking to get into the country and, what again? I asked Mike Odle, public affairs and communications officer for Shasta-Trinity National Forest's Northern California Coordination Center to elaborate on what was behind the increase in cultivated cannabis on Shasta's public lands."Most of the increase can be attributed to the proliferation of foreign Drug Trafficking Organizations (DTOs), mostly Mexican in origin, which operate in the Shasta-Trinity National Forest and throughout California and much of the United States," Odle explained to me by email. "Frequently using illegal aliens residing outside the United States, or recently smuggled across the [sic] boarder, these Mexican criminal groups establish, maintain and protect an increasing number of clandestine operations."Yet, predictably, Odle couldn't explain what made them terrorists."Some DTOs have been linked by law enforcement and investigations to terrorist organizations and pose a substantial and increasing threat to national security," he added in a subsequent email. "Our primary concern here on the Shasta-Trinity National Forest is the safety of our forest visitors and agency employees and the negative impacts marijuana has on the environment and natural resources, no matter what name is given to the DTOs that are illegally growing marijuana on America's public lands."No matter what name is given? Easy enough if you're the one doing the naming. If you're the one being flippantly tagged a terrorist? Not so much.Plus, there are enough holes in the argument to plant your own cannabis seeds. To start with, cannabis may be many things, but it is far from an environmental negative. It has been used for medicinal purposes for thousands of years, can grow in almost any climate, and is a naturally occurring dioecious perennial. (In other words, it's not fossil fuel.) Further, Odle's claim that safety is Shasta's first concern is understandable, but he offered no examples of violent activity by any of the area growers to legitimize the ONDCP's inflammatory language. Sure, the fact that "some" DTOs have been linked to terrorist organizations is educational, but as with everything the ONDCP touches, specifics are elusive and generalizations are everywhere.I pressed Odle for further clarification on the terrorism question. But instead of al Qaeda, all I got was more obfuscation. And more Mexicans."Do [sic] to ongoing investigations, I am limited in what I can share," Odle explained in another email. "When we do the investigations we try to get up as far as we can into the food chain. We work closely with the DEA, FBI, ICE and other law enforcement agencies that have the capabilities to identify who these folks are and what links they may or may not have."Fair enough. It's out of his hands. Any concrete local examples?"I can [sic] site an example in a case we are now finished investigating. The Forest Service was heavily involved with the eradication of marijuana gardens associated with the Magana drug cartel. The Magana drug cartel operation and investigation occurred throughout National Forests in California, Utah and Arkansas, with direct ties to Mexico. Investigators in the Magana case said cartel leaders brought in illegal workers from the Mexican states of Michoacan and Jalisco."In short, terrorism isn't the real problem here, it's illegal immigration. Not convinced? When you get a chance, search Google for "Magana drug cartel" and let me know if you can find anything. Even better, try the ONDCP, and let me know if anything unrelated to cocaine shows up. Even if you give Walters, Odle and other so-called counterterrorism experts their due on the Magana drug cartel or other so-called terrorist organizations who the ONDCP cannot actually name (making sure to look up the definition of "cartel" in the process, if you want to be exhaustive about it), what you end up with are cannabis traffickers and cultivators operating illegally on public lands using undocumented immigrants.Illegal activity? Fine. Terrorism? Are you high?The Bush administration's hypocritical bait-and-switch between terrorism and immigration is clumsy for certain, but it is especially glaring in light of a recent Washington Times article criticizing none other than President Bush himself. According to the piece, a "2006 audit showed federal, state and local governments are among the biggest employers of the half-million persons in the U.S. illegally using 'non-work' Social Security numbers -- numbers issued legally, but with specific instructions that the holders are not authorized to work in the U.S." And that charge was leveled by Iowa Republican and ranking member of the House Judiciary Committee's immigration subcommittee Rep. Steve King, in a politically conservative publication founded by Rev. Sun Myung Moon, cult leader of the Unification Church.Even the Moonies think that Bush needs to start throwing what the president's own drug czar would call terrorists out of his own White House, before he starts worrying about anyone else. After all, according to the audit, his own government is a much worse offender than the ragged Magana cartel growing cannabis in the forests of Redding.By the time the ONDCP's talking points touched on other byproducts of commercially cultivated cannabis terrorism -- "fire violations, unsanitary conditions, littering, smoking, building unauthorized structures, unauthorized camping and cutting trees without a permit to name a few," in Odle's words -- I began to more fully understand the power of language. By capitalizing on a nationally manufactured fear and simply merging words into each other, the Bush administration has created from its hyperreal imagination a living policy that can have real-world ramifications for those trampled beneath its fluid terminology.The good news is that the Democrats in Congress are at least trying to make up for their heinous complicity in the Military Commissions Act, whose passage helped enable this linguistic nightmare in the first place. As recently as July 2007, Committee on Oversight and Government Reform chairman Rep. Henry Waxman wrote Walters asking why American taxpayers have been footing the bill for ONDCP officials to travel around the country with Republican candidates stumping for election at the behest of Karl Rove. Striking hard at Bush administration politicization of the ONDCP is a good start, but stopping their ability to label anyone anything they want would go much farther to restoring sensible policy, on drugs and everything else, for the rest of our new millennium.We're going to need help soon, if the recent white papers on drug abuse from the ONDCP are any indication. Because they've enlisted God for help in beating back the devil weed, as their fact sheet "Marijuana and Kids: Faith" explains: "Religion and religiosity repeatedly correlate with lower teen and adult marijuana and substance use rates and buffer the impact of life stress which can lead to marijuana and substance use. ... Other studies show that teens who don't view faith as important are up to four times more likely to use marijuana."In other words, smoke up, heretical terrorist! You're not only fueling al Qaeda's mass murder by purchasing weed cultivated by illegal Mexicans in the rural public lands of the world, but you're also turning your back on God in the process. As well as replacing the Bush administration's real world with your selfish virtual reality in which cannabis is a relatively harmless, naturally occurring plant that can chill you out as much as it can fill you out. A massive, multiplayer simulation where pot is a viable medicinal alternative to synthesized painkillers like oxycontin, which ease your agony by killing you off altogether.According to the Bush administration and its politicized ONDCP, you need to unplug from that moonbat matrix and start praying. Fast. Or else. Scott Thill runs the online mag: http://www.morphizm.com/His writing has appeared in Salon, XLR8R, All Music Guide, Wired and others. Note: Under Bush, terror has become a justification for any and every abuse of power. Newshawk: DankhankSource: AlterNet (US)Author:  Scott Thill, AlterNetPublished: August 29, 2007Copyright: 2007 Independent Media InstituteContact: letters alternet.org Website: http://www.alternet.org/DL: http://alternet.org/drugreporter/60854/CannabisNews -- Cannabis Archiveshttp://cannabisnews.com/news/list/cannabis.shtml

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Comment #41 posted by museman on October 29, 2008 at 10:31:06 PT
JackJack - Hope
Welcome to our little front porch.Hope;You can do a search for your favorite threads and post on them. If you remember a topic, you can find the old thread.Like I told FoM the other day, these old threads contain jewels. Someone ought to go through them someday and publish some of the more profound quotes. Just about everyone on this site would be represented, because just about everyone that posts here posts profoundly at one time or another.FREE UNOTQUE FOR EVERYONE
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Comment #40 posted by Hope on October 29, 2008 at 07:17:49 PT
Hello and welcome, Jackjack.
Glad to see you.Something I'm curious about. How and why do people find these old threads to comment on?This is an interesting thread, though, for sure, and I enjoy going back and reading the articles and comments that have become part of our history. But how and why did you choose it? It's over a year old. 
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Comment #39 posted by FoM on October 29, 2008 at 06:39:24 PT
jackjack
Welcome to CNews.
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Comment #38 posted by jackjack on October 28, 2008 at 22:03:23 PT:
hi 2 all....
Hi i am new comer to this site......
I am very happy to join this site........
I gathered lot of information from this site.....
I enjoyed when i read those posts in this site.....
The way of presentation is really too good.......
The article is interesting and the information is really useful for me.....jack
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Comment #37 posted by user123 on August 31, 2007 at 11:27:17 PT:
They're Blind & Can not See
the "terrorists" growing weed in Shasta County, as the Redding Record Searchlight reported, "wouldn't hesitate to help other terrorists get into the country with the aim of causing mass casualties."..............So their aim is to make money, to give to terrorists, so that they can then kill the very customers that provide the money? Doesn't sound like a very sound business practice to me. Oh, wait, that's right, because it's total BS.
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Comment #36 posted by NikoKun on August 30, 2007 at 10:48:28 PT
simply...
If it was legal, the money wouldn't be going anywhere, except into the economy. But as long as it is illegal, criminals will be the ones to grow it, because it's unregulated, and highly profitable.Once you legalize it, you kill the criminal market and criminal profits... Because the price goes down, and because then the law is on the Legit grower's side... And violence cannot be used to solve disputes anymore.I always hate how they tie in the criminal market and violence with Marijuana... Cause if they REALLY wanted to put an end to those problems, They'd be in favor of legalizing it.
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Comment #35 posted by Hope on August 29, 2007 at 23:57:59 PT
That is a good one!
"And that's because it wasn't 'them' (the 'right people') who had anything to give, teach, or show me that wasn't what I didn't want to know, see, hear, or do. (Who say's you can't use a double negative effectively?)":0)Goodnight, my friend.
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Comment #34 posted by Hope on August 29, 2007 at 23:54:07 PT
Indeed, Museman.
You know I was just repeating what I've heard some people say. Besides, you ARE a rich man, in so many ways, besides money, anyway. But you know that.They took your home from you and your family. I don't like that. I think it was so wrong that they did that to you and yours.Stuff like that is part of why I ever even found this place, C-News. They might have had the "Legal" right to do it. But it was still wrong. At least, thank God, I have the liberty to say it.
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Comment #33 posted by museman on August 29, 2007 at 23:13:53 PT
Hope
"They suffered, Museman. You were just out there "Having fun" and "Goofing off"." That's right, those are 'laugh wrinkles' on my forehead."You didn't want to put the time in "Studying" and they did." Actually, I just didn't want to 'study' war, greed, competition, and self-satisfaction-at-any-cost individuality. I tried though; Bakersfield College, CSU, COCC, and RCC - the curriculum just didn't fill my needs. They don't offer 'Truth 101.' When I finally gave up on academia, I had a 3.8 on the Collegiate National Honor Role. I got that from 'not studying' trigonometry, electronics, assembly code, and boolean logic function - to name a few. Back when I thought 'skill and talent' meant more than looks and popularity."One mistake you may have made, Museman, you didn't pay the right people for what you learned."And that's because it wasn't 'them' (the 'right people') who had anything to give, teach, or show me that wasn't what I didn't want to know, see, hear, or do. (Who say's you can't use a double negative effectively?) No my 'mistake' was not being born with a bank account.It's just that the 'medium of exchange' between me and YHWH is not recognized in the temporal materialism 'reality' as legal tender.And I will say it again; 'Higher education' (like the corrupt social value system that spawns it) is over-rated.
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Comment #32 posted by FoM on August 29, 2007 at 21:20:47 PT
Hope
Thanks. That sounds absolutely immoral to me.
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Comment #31 posted by Hope on August 29, 2007 at 21:15:02 PT
Social Darwinism is sort of a
Social Eugenics situation. He means let them die out. They aren't people of real value and they should evolve themselves out of the picture...by dying and disappearing, or becoming extinct or developing into something as "highly evolved" as he has decided he is. Or something like that.Eugenics was what Hitler was all about. That theory was that it was a "Good" thing...to "Help" them die out or become "Extinct", you might say. It sort or rushes things along to that "More highly evolved" society...of people that think like O'Buttsky . Eugenics is more sweeping and effective than Darwinism. Darwinism, to him, expresses a more passive hatred than Eugenics. He's in the passive hate business. Eugenics gets busy moving things along. Darwinism is just waiting. Passively.Makes me think of Copperheads, who wait a lot...as opposed to Water Moccasins who get out there and look for something to despise and kill.:0) Then again...I might be mistaken.I know EJohnson could explain it clearly. There's likely a lot better way to say it than I did.
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Comment #30 posted by FoM on August 29, 2007 at 20:54:39 PT

A Question
We saw a piece with Bill O'Reilly tonight and he said Capitalism is like Social Darwinism or something close to that? What did he mean? They were talking about having to use tax dollars to help poor people. He said he wouldn't help a drug addict because they brought it on themselves? 
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Comment #29 posted by Hope on August 29, 2007 at 20:50:01 PT

But they went to school. They studied.
They suffered, Museman. You were just out there "Having fun" and "Goofing off". "You didn't want to put the time in "Studying" and they did. One mistake you may have made, Museman, you didn't pay the right people for what you learned. "When human equality is destroyed by ideologies of comparative values -invented and determined by the class of humanity that happens to control it; wealth and property as a measured parameter of human value and worth- when one man's time is considered 'more valuable' than any other's, the error, and great crime, has been committed."
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Comment #28 posted by FoM on August 29, 2007 at 20:43:35 PT

Hope
I remember that now too. Why didn't they send the inspectors to those sites right away? I just caught the last 45 minutes of Leonard Cohen's I'm Your Man. What a really good movie. 
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Comment #27 posted by Hope on August 29, 2007 at 20:40:44 PT

NikoKun
"First they criminalize it... and THEN they attribute the problems with criminalization, to the plant ITSELF... As if the plant, has some natural/magical inherent property which gives money to terrorists... -_-Are they mentally incapable of practicing common sense on these issues?"Excellent comment and I agree."Are they mentally incapable of practicing common sense on these issues?"Actually, I'm afraid they might be. I'm pretty sure they really do think what they are doing is the "Common sense" thing to do. Even more, "It's the right thing to do." "All out war", "Search and destroy", "Freedom from drugs", are but a few of their battle cries and mantras. They "Go into battle, ready to sacrifice and die for the war", they fight. Not a lot of thinking. Goal oriented. But not a lot of thinking.

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Comment #26 posted by Hope on August 29, 2007 at 20:23:24 PT

Comment #10
"Why couldn't we see WMD before we invaded Iraq by satellite?"I believe that concept was presented to the public. Warehouses. People moving stuff in and out. 
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Comment #25 posted by Hope on August 29, 2007 at 20:18:24 PT

NikoKun
First... they came for the Meth Cooks. Meth brewers or cooks or manufacturers, I believe, are also slapped with terrorism charges in some areas and have been for quite a long time. Now they are after pot farmers. The latest, "Terrorists".
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Comment #24 posted by NikoKun on August 29, 2007 at 19:26:38 PT

This again?
Isn't it common sense, and obvious... that Cannabis only funds criminals, BECAUSE IT'S ILLEGAL.
Growers, wouldn't be criminals if it was legal to grow, and criminals wouldn't be growing it if it was legal.Are they going to start charging growers as Terrorists now too? -_- good god...First they criminalize it... and THEN they attribute the problems with criminalization, to the plant ITSELF... As if the plant, has some natural/magical inherent property which gives money to terrorists... -_-Are they mentally incapable of practicing common sense on these issues?
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Comment #23 posted by museman on August 29, 2007 at 13:29:19 PT

Hope
It's about values. When human equality is destroyed by ideologies of comparative values -invented and determined by the class of humanity that happens to control it; wealth and property as a measured parameter of human value and worth- when one man's time is considered 'more valuable' than any other's, the error, and great crime, has been committed.If as many free-thinking people believe, we are all 'created equal' and we share the same moments under the sun, rain, wind, and the stars, then who is qualified to determine that such time as is given by 'God' is somehow worth more compensation merely by the word of the powerful?We may be forced, literally -like the current police state we live in- to capitulate to such a scheme and con-job, and our ancestors had the same problems with their 'ruling class' but that does not change the truth. The sooner that enough people embrace and hold to the truth, the sooner that ancient house of the Devil's tarot cards comesa crashing down for good, and forever. kind of like the 'hundredth monkey syndrome.'
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Comment #22 posted by Hope on August 29, 2007 at 13:13:42 PT

Of course...
He might remind you that his "Job" is keeping you busy making him money. As much money as possible! It doesn't matter that you are doing the work...."I should and do get more because it's my ideas that get jobs for those that don't have ideas for ways for other people to make money for them."Reasonable sharing would eliminate this problem, this hatred.By "Reasonable sharing"...I mean the man who does the work gets a fair part of the profit...which would never be less than half.What?
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Comment #21 posted by FoM on August 29, 2007 at 13:09:52 PT

My Wish
I really want so much to go to Obama's blog (I don't post I only read) and not see it flamed by right wing haters. They had so many complaints that they have stop at least one person from posting and when he is bannned he registers as another person but everyone knows it's the same person and he is soon banned again. Why don't people go and do something positive for whoever they think is the right candidate instead of trying to destroy what the people on that blog want? I don't get that mentality. If anyone thinks the drug war will end no matter who is the next president they need to ask at least 10 people a point blank question like do you believe we should legalize, cocaine, heroin and meth and let the answer show you where society stands on the drug issue currently. The same thing goes for dispensaries that are profiting. Ask 10 people is that ok and then see where we are and go from there.
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Comment #20 posted by Hope on August 29, 2007 at 13:09:01 PT

Bears repeating....
Some rich guy tries to tell me to 'get a job' I say, "YOU FIRST!"
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Comment #19 posted by Hope on August 29, 2007 at 13:07:56 PT

Museman
Greatest response I've ever heard!:0)
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Comment #18 posted by FoM on August 29, 2007 at 12:56:32 PT

museman
I get what you mean. I agree.
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Comment #17 posted by museman on August 29, 2007 at 12:46:14 PT

FoM
There is a difference between 'work and labor' and 'job.'Starving people in Africa labor hard and long every day just to survive another one, yet they recieve no monetary compensation.Poor people in this country work their asses off for the table scraps of the rich. The labor of life is NOT SYNONYMOUS to the 40 hour work week. The 'American work ethic' does not include labor without monetary compensation (or it's equivalent in goods and services). Even preachers think they need a paycheck.I am tired of those who actually don't work, or labor, but let their money 'work for them' acting like their 'work' is more important than those who actually sweat and toil at 'making a living.' Their cash ain't nothin' but trash, and useless even as toilet paper.In the presence of Divine Judgement, their 
'labors' will count as nothing, so I am not about to render credibility now while their 'labors' are almost solely responsible for war, destruction, fear, pestilence, and death.Having to labor every day of my life, suffered physical, irreversable damage for a fistful of dollars, and still condemned to poverty, even after over 55 years of life and labor, I am under NO ILLUSIONS as to what is really going on. And no amount of verbal justification can erase the facts of the matter; the aquisition of wealth and property is held in highest esteem by the eyes of the world, and that is the corruption that condemns a significant portion of mankind to lifetimes of suffering and pain. Labor and work is the legacy of humanity in a realm governed by gravity and entropic decay, but there is no stipulation anywhere, in any of the great works of wisdom - scriptures, philosophy,- that the determination of a persons worth is made in the hours of a day in service to the beast that destroys us.Some rich guy tries to tell me to 'get a job' I say, "YOU FIRST!"
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Comment #16 posted by FoM on August 29, 2007 at 11:55:37 PT

whig
I went thru the article but it is a little deep for me to absorb. I have my feelings about Bin Laden from seeing F/9/11.
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Comment #15 posted by whig on August 29, 2007 at 11:42:14 PT

FoM
Who does Osama bin Laden work for?http://www.guardian.co.uk/wtccrash/story/0,,551037,00.html
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Comment #14 posted by FoM on August 29, 2007 at 11:26:34 PT

museman
An example is I am so happy we were able to get our house fixed up and it is wonderful but it could all be gone by a tornado and the only thing that really matters to me is that my husband would be ok. We might be older but we could start again somehow. I believe in keeping things in a proper order.
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Comment #13 posted by FoM on August 29, 2007 at 11:22:50 PT

museman
I believe we all need to work to have a life with a little bit of comfort and that I understand but to love money or what it can buy has never made sense to me. In a heartbeat we can lose our life's possessions so we should keep them in a proper perspective. 
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Comment #12 posted by museman on August 29, 2007 at 11:09:49 PT

FoM
"Fear is not from God."Neither is the Government, or any of it's officers or wannbe officers.Neither is the social Status Quo that defines and determines the values and systems that we live with and by.Neither is hoarded wealth, and the power held by such.Neither is America, or any other nation that bases it's reality on the economic base of it's wealthy, above and beyond it's people.Paranoia is a tried and true tool of propaganda, and a means of keeping the ignorant fearful and ignorant. Paranoia is used to keep everyone showing up for work every weekday, and it is used as a tool to keep the children of the rich from becoming more human. Paranoia is very useful to power -mongers. But without the support and belief of the masses to begin with, there could be no purchase for all of their little schemes. Americans BELIEVE in money and materialism, so they are easily led down the path to destruction. Americans have FAITH in the dollar bill, so they are much afraid of finding out their error, let alone doing something about it.
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Comment #11 posted by FoM on August 29, 2007 at 10:57:50 PT

museman
Who the heck are the commies that they think are coming? I don't get things like that. It appears to be paranoia more then anything. Fear is not from God.
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Comment #10 posted by FoM on August 29, 2007 at 10:49:52 PT

Hope
Why couldn't we see WMD before we invaded Iraq by satellite? Another thing I hope happens. Instead of people trying to trip up Democrats since that would be Republicans or right leaning parties doing it why don't they go after their own Party and let the Democrats alone? I never would flame a Republican board. It really is amazing the hate I see towards Democrats by the right wing.I don't hate republicans I just ignore them. That doesn't hurt anyone that way.
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Comment #9 posted by museman on August 29, 2007 at 10:49:07 PT

back to the days of fear and loathing in America
The Commies are coming! The Commies are coming!"The Red Menace."Oh! Labels and nomenclature have changed!The terrorists are here! The terrorists are here!See what happens when you give too much power to monkeys?The Communist 'threat' was finally defanged for good when the wall came fell down. It only took them about 10 years to set up the new fear and loathing -terrorism. Funded the Taliban AND Alqueda. Set up all the scenarios, then created the 9/11 - and now cannabis is a tool of the terrorists!?At this point, with all the damage being done by those with money (soldiers don't buy their own weapons) I think it's time to rethink cause and effect, maybe put the spot on the real problems in the world -namely people who use money as power, the system of weights and measures that empowers the illusory false values of capitalism (not 'free enterprise' or free market).But of course that is the catch 22, and the power rich all know it, why else would a monkey like bush and his jungle-buddies get away with murder, mayhem, pillage and destruction? While poor American kids are dying at just above minimum wage (an improvement over VietNam) Haliburton, and all the other "...you are my base" bushmonkey carpetbaggers are raking it in. The Oil companies are recognizing 'record profits' even though there was supposedly shortages and the Arabs raised prices.Either most of Americans are just plain idiots, or they are lacking in the mental faculties that the rest of the world use to determine such things as 'the truth,' and having the words and terminology keep the same meanings for more than a few months before some new twist or 'definition' is added under the guise of 'patriotism' or 'national security.'I think that too many people are just bound to their lifestyles -provided by the status quo- and are too used to unconsciousness; too used to having TV, video, and all the other RICH-PEOPLE-CONTROLLED media do their thinking for them. I think that the wake-up call came in the '60's, but all the power was bought and sold, and failing that assassinated.Every tank of gas is paid for in human suffering. Every moment of fantasy escape through Hollywood gets us farther from our brothers and sisters who need basic reality from us, not token 'charity' or arrogant lip-service from those who make their living off of the suffering.The air is thinning because the trees are disappearing. The great forests that have been our life-support system since creation began, have all been destroyed. Our atmosphere has been riddled with un-natural punctures from the stupidity of the 'space program' which was always about war and not about 'space exploration' though the government has kept their scientists happy by funding zillion dollar probes to Mars and such.And of course we currently have 'The Elections.' Another chance for enough hot air to float many ballons. The candidates are all members of the same club. They all wear designer clothers, drive the most expensive cars, and are accustomed to paying hundreds of dollars for a meal (often at taxpayers expense -even though they have millions in the bank).So by all means, keep filling those gas tanks, keep buying Mcdunalds and Booger King- so more forests can go up in smoke for the cows. Keep watching the Roman games and eating the bread while the world falls down around us. I'm afraid until it actually reaches their doors, most Americans are quite content to remain ignorant and apathetic, and care more about the wax job on their car than the pain of their neighbors.The only difference between the 'Cold War' and the 'War on Terror' is that there is no 'detente' and because there are no 'nations' involved, wholesale slaughter and destruction can be made against anyone that the powers decide to point their finger at and call 'terrorist.'America is going to die in it's sleep.
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Comment #8 posted by Hope on August 29, 2007 at 10:44:08 PT

Bin Laden
It seems odd to me that they haven't found him. What happened to the satellite technology that can see anyone, anywhere, anytime crap? Anyone but Bin Laden, I guess. The American people. They treat us like mushrooms. Feeding and threatening us with "you know what", all the time. There's not just one man, one "Wizard", but a pretty good sized crowd of "Wizards", "Hiding behind the curtain". They threaten and try to confuse people on purpose. "Confusion is not of God."
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Comment #7 posted by FoM on August 29, 2007 at 10:26:55 PT

Hope
We still haven't found Bin Laden. It's amazing how he has been forgotten when Iraq became the focus.
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Comment #6 posted by Hope on August 29, 2007 at 10:18:24 PT

 Bitter uses of honey in Bin Laden's network
http://www.iol.co.za/general/newsview.php?art_id=qw100339848123B221&click_id=3&set_id=1
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Comment #5 posted by Hope on August 29, 2007 at 10:11:05 PT

Whig
You mean, "I don't think there was a deliberate attempt to kill the bees"?"I don't think there is a deliberate attempt to kill the bees, they are collateral."I don't think there IS a deliberate attempt to kill the bees. I think perhaps there WAS a deliberate attempt to kill SOME bees. Neither would I be surprised to learn one of those nuts out to "shut down the terrorist's sources of revenue" might not have done it. "Oh yeah...we have bees, too, but we know it won't spread all the way back here. It will only decimate THEIR bees." It's easy to imagine it and if I can imagine it...someone else could have imagined it, too.
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Comment #4 posted by whig on August 29, 2007 at 09:05:01 PT

Hope
I think the more likely problem is not a parasite but a toxin, such as genetically engineered crops with terminator genes which the bees are encountering. I don't think there is a deliberate attempt to kill the bees, they are collateral. Very serious, however. If we lose the bees we lose more than honey, we lose many of our crops which depend on bees for fertilization.
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Comment #3 posted by Hope on August 29, 2007 at 07:51:26 PT

A thought...
that's been on my mind lately.Some of you may remember, as I do, that some news sources, before they were quieted, in the ensuing months after 9-11, reported that the "terrorists" were making a huge amount of money from not oil, not drugs...but HONEY. I remember those reports. It just wasn't exciting enough to use for propaganda in the long run, I guess. After a few times, there was no more said about it.I've been thinking about fusarium and the Pandora's Box that it is, off and on. Of course. The drug warriors want to use it to wipe out certain plants they don't like and would like to wipe from the face of the earth...to hell with the eco-system when it comes to cannabis and coca. Just kill it and any thing that gets in the way is just collateral loss and a "necessary" risk, has been the howling drive of the craziest of the drug warriors.Anyway...the honey stories paled in comparison to the stories...oil a little....drugs a lot. Drugs an awful lot. But we knew they'd scramble for a way to tie it to drugs. We knew they'd do that, even before the smoke was cleared in New York.Back to the honey. Thinking of fusarium and the moon bats wanting to wipe out the "wicked" plants. Suddenly...a few years later...another bad thing is happening to the eco-system. All the bees are dieing. All the little honey producers.... dieing. As never before. Finally after much ado...it was discovered that a tiny bee parasite was the killer. Things that make you go "Hmmmm."A new parasite? No. I don't think so. But one suddenly so prolific that it threatens the entire world's bees? I would not be in the least surprised, if ...oh...about fifty years from now we discovered that that parasite was bred and released to kill those nefarious Al Qaida honey makers...and income for them...but ...."Oh no. The wind shifted"... "Oh no. Too many parasites." "Oh no."The same nuts that want to wipe out entire species of plant life...because they want to and because it's just money for the "terrorists" are the same nuts that would want certain bees to die.Controlling insects with using specific insect parasites and releasing other insect predators against them has been done, scientifically, for years and years. Yes. It's just another conspiracy theory...but you probably hadn't heard that one before.

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Comment #2 posted by smoknjoe on August 29, 2007 at 07:25:45 PT:

bush?
Boy would suggest he's human, he's not human he's a beast from Hell. The devils servent.
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Comment #1 posted by Storm Crow on August 29, 2007 at 06:11:07 PT

bush....
The "boy" who cried "Terrorist"!
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