cannabisnews.com: New Challenges for Medical Marijuana










  New Challenges for Medical Marijuana

Posted by CN Staff on July 19, 2007 at 06:33:52 PT
Editorial 
Source: Los Angeles Times  

Washington, DC -- The Drug Enforcement Administration has notified more than 150 Los Angeles property owners that their fortunes and their sacred honor are forfeit to the state. What crime must a landlady commit to deserve this punishment? Renting to a tenant who operates a medical marijuana dispensary. The DEA sent out letters last week notifying owners that they stand to lose their properties and face 20 years in prison for allowing their buildings to be used for "unlawfully … distributing or using a controlled substance."
The only good news in this deplorable new bullying tactic by the federal drug cops is that if you're a property owner, your least-bad option is fairly clear. You can honor the will of California voters, allow the dispensary to stay and lose your property, or you can evict the tenant and risk a costly lawsuit. You're better off taking your chances with the lawsuit, although the DEA will not admit this. A representative of the agency's L.A. office uses the Orwellian phrase "these letters were merely to educate property owners," but concedes that in fact the letters serve to weaken the legal position of landlords. That's because the Civil Asset Forfeiture Reform Act of 2000 specifies that landlords must have provable knowledge of drug activities to be subject to asset forfeiture. The DEA's letter-writing campaign establishes that paper trail, while coyly avoiding giving property owners any advice about what to do. The agency confirms, however, that the "long-term goal" is to get landlords to evict dispensaries. Nor is this strictly a private property matter; public property is at risk, as the city of West Hollywood found out a few years ago when the DEA seized $300,000 the city had provided to help purchase a building for a dispensary. As they have for the last several years, Reps. Dana Rohrabacher (R-Huntington Beach) and Maurice D. Hinchey (D-N.Y.) are sponsoring an amendment that would kill funding for federal efforts to preempt state medical marijuana initiatives, and although Congress should in general avoid this kind of procedural finagling, it would at least halt the DEA's efforts to thwart the will of voters and legislatures in 12 states. And if the DEA refuses to listen, Congress should consider doing away with civil asset forfeiture altogether. Note: The Drug Enforcement Administration goes after landlords who rent to dispensaries.Source: Los Angeles Times (CA)Published: July 19, 2007 Copyright: 2007 Los Angeles TimesContact: letters latimes.comWebsite: http://www.latimes.com/Related Article: Medical Marijuana Outlets May Be Closedhttp://cannabisnews.com/news/thread23177.shtmlCannabisNews Medical Marijuana Archiveshttp://cannabisnews.com/news/list/medical.shtml 

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Comment #158 posted by unkat27 on July 28, 2007 at 08:28:32 PT
Whig
Thanx for the feedback on this. Sorry for the late reply. The truth is, i got really blasted on alcohol shortly after my last post on this thread and completely forgot about it.My situation is complicated and can't go into details now. Thanx for the concern, I'll work it out somehow.Btw, I've done the research and most CA rents are at least twice what i am paying here now.
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Comment #157 posted by whig on July 23, 2007 at 13:08:44 PT
A more perfect union
When another state ends cannabis prohibition there will be thirteen free states of America.Manumit.
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Comment #156 posted by whig on July 23, 2007 at 12:22:05 PT
As my wife says sometimes...
Take a bus take a plane take a railroad train.
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Comment #155 posted by whig on July 23, 2007 at 12:16:49 PT
Other expenses
In Pennsylvania our monthly housing cost was about $700 and it went up to about $1100 when we moved to California, but my medical insurance costs went from $1100/month down to $400/month. So it's cheaper here for us -- the place is smaller, too, but I don't feel the need to stay inside as much because the weather is so nice.Slight chance of earthquake on any given day, but there ya go.
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Comment #154 posted by whig on July 23, 2007 at 12:12:53 PT
low cost housing
I should also say that even in places where average rents are high there are usually low rent places available. We pay much much less than the average for San Francisco, in fact we pay less than the average for any of those top ten cities.
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Comment #153 posted by whig on July 23, 2007 at 12:09:37 PT
unkat27
I misstated that. I didn't mean to say always cost the most but they cost more than they would if they weren't nice places, for the same reason as anything nice costs more. But as long as you can afford to survive somewhere, and you can survive better where cannabis is legal I think, you can probably prosper more easily than where you are repressed.
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Comment #152 posted by whig on July 23, 2007 at 12:07:20 PT
Economics
The nicest places to live always cost the most, but they also nurture their communities. That means you can arrive in a place with little but a willingness to find a way to be helpful and be sustained.
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Comment #151 posted by whig on July 23, 2007 at 11:51:12 PT
10 most expensive rental markets
Where you'll pay the most per month.Area 	State 	Avg rent in 2006New York 	NY 	$2,553San Francisco 	CA 	$1,685Boston 	    MA 	$1,632New Haven 	CT 	$1,485Orange County 	CA 	$1,458San Jose 	CA 	$1,445N. New Jersey 	NJ 	$1,404Los Angeles 	CA 	$1,360Oakland 	CA 	$1,262San Diego 	CA 	$1,250
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Comment #150 posted by whig on July 23, 2007 at 11:38:25 PT
FWIW
Massachusetts is known to be nearly as expensive as California.
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Comment #149 posted by whig on July 23, 2007 at 10:54:08 PT
unkat27
There are parts of California that are not expensive, I think. Do you need to live in a major city?
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Comment #148 posted by unkat27 on July 23, 2007 at 10:11:57 PT
Btw
Btw, I ordered some seeds once and the local DEA intercepted them. I'll never forget the way that guy looked at me. He was talking all big to the "female" mailbox manager about how they once intercepted a big box of green weed that they thought was pot and it turned out to be oregano.He looked at me like he was tough shit and just wanted me to start something. I suppose I'm supposed to be thankful that the guy was nice enough to not press any charges, but the truth is, a small packet of pot seeds wasn't really enough to make a big fuss over, and he wanted to keep an eye on me and see if he could catch me with more.Later, the apartments where i live was put under a "bomb-scare" situation and everyone was evacuated and the cops checked my apartment out and found zilch. Now, i got a damn piglet fascist ex-cop turned domestic spy living right over my head, sticking his nose so far up my ass that he knows what I am thinking, when I fantasize about sex, and when I use the shit-can. Yeah, I'm gettin outa here alright, soon as I find the means and a place to go.
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Comment #147 posted by unkat27 on July 23, 2007 at 10:00:48 PT
Life below Poverty Line
Living below the poverty-line guys. I'm a real loser. I was born in poverty, raised in poverty, and never escaped it. In this wonderful land of opportunity, I guess that makes me one of the biggest losers in the world.I also have had some bad raps with the law and they watch me like hawks. I can't accept help through the mail cuz domestic spies cover that area in this place.Why don't I move? I'm looking, been looking to move, for about 6 months now. Problem is, all the rental rates are too high. I just don't make enough money to move anywhere else, cept maybe a few places where the cops are even worse than they are here.I don't know if you guys realize it but, there's this odd coincidence about all the best places for cannabis users in the states (and world in general). The rental rates and property taxes are all the highest in the nation. See, when the DEA fascists decided to start this war, their big pig corporate sponsers knew it wouldn't affect them. Some of the same pigs that support the DEA use cannabis and cocaine privately, without a care in the world, cuz the law can't touch them. In the USA, if you truly want to be free, you need big money. That's American equality in a nutshell.Wanna help me out? Support my work. It's all I have going for me. Anybody know some musicians that do soundtrack material? Maybe we can make a deal.
Lost Planet Animation
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Comment #146 posted by Max Flowers on July 23, 2007 at 09:16:49 PT
whig
I second that... totally baffled. I've even offered to send the poor guy some medicine in the mail, and he won't take it out of paranoia (understandable, but come on, no one is watching him THAT closely, and it's easy to address it to a different name to reduce any chance of trouble down to 0.1%).The impression I get, unkat, is that you enjoy complaining more than you really want relief. The offer still stands... I will send you some today if you ask me to and slip me an address (just use not your name, but the name of a prior tenant that you occasionally still get mail for. Everyone has one.) The tricky part is how to slip me your address.
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Comment #145 posted by whig on July 22, 2007 at 20:49:56 PT
unkat27
I guess I still don't understand why you don't move if you are so miserable there.
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Comment #144 posted by unkat27 on July 22, 2007 at 11:44:42 PT
Observer, #135
-- "Pot isn't easy to find. And if you do find it, it is way too expensive."Yes, that's the way it is. Glad to hear somebody else in this forum understands how hard it is on guys like me in the anti-pot blue and red states (also below the poverty-line, at the same time).I haven't had any in over 3 years, and sad to say, I've went back on the bottle again, to relieve my anxiety. My ulcer is real happy with that (NOT!)!
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Comment #143 posted by FoM on July 22, 2007 at 11:44:33 PT
unkat27 
I understand why you like him. He doesn't think like how I feel so I must follow my conscience as we all must do.
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Comment #142 posted by unkat27 on July 22, 2007 at 11:34:58 PT
FoM, #139
-- "Why does he call his supporters wackos?" -- FoMThat wasn't Paul who said that, it was Bill Dumas of the Pasadena Meetup Group, one of Paul's support groups in California.-- "The head of the Pasadena Meetup group, Bill Dumas, sent a desperate letter to Paul headquarters asking for guidance:“We’re in a difficult position of working on a campaign that draws supporters from laterally opposing points of view, and we have the added bonus of attracting every wacko fringe group in the country..." "What Dumas seems to be saying is that there are fringe groups on both the right and the left that are interested in Paul, even though many of them are opposed to each other on many issues. The result being that its overly complicated trying to speak to all of them about the issues in the same meeting.Thanks for the article, FoM. It's generally okay but it does have a few minor erroneous points.-- "Although he is still in the [low single digits] in polls, he says he has raised $2.4 million in the second quarter, enough to broaden the four-state campaign he originally planned into a national one."This is vague and untrue. There have been several online polls that put Paul in the lead with over 90 percent of the votes. This is just another example of how the MSM is ignoring the internet. There are obviously good points and bad points about Paul, but even he admits that he cannot change the law. The good points, being antiwar, anti big government, anti-imperial, pro-cannabis, imo, out-weigh the bad points by a long shot. 
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Comment #141 posted by unkat27 on July 22, 2007 at 10:39:08 PT
Whig, #137
-- "Some people are going to have to take a stand in your state, one way or another."They have been taking a stand for over a decade. Every year or two the people vote on measures to reform and decriminalize cannabis and/or legalize medical cannabis and every time that happens, over 80 percent of the people vote in favor of decriminalization and legalization of medical cannabis, and every time that happens, the law department ignores it (it's called a non-binding vote) and/or the state congress vetoes it. The ruling-class simply ignores it and continues business-as-usual, as if the people have no say in government policy whatsoever. Of course, whenever people get mad, they get treated like terrorists, so that doesn't work. Apparently, fighting for one's rights is all just so much historical myth now. People are too dumbed-down, scared, and pro-pacifist to do anything about it. Of course, I understand how pacific most pro-cannabis people are, and it looks like the big-pigs in the ruling-class do too. They shit all over pacifists and pacifists bathe in it like its no big deal.
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Comment #140 posted by Hope on July 22, 2007 at 08:11:07 PT
Availability of cannabis through out US
Sadly, thanks to prohibition, I've been told that, in many areas, it's generally much easier and quicker for most people to obtain hard drugs, like meth, heroin, and cocaine.Cannabis is bulky with a strong, distinct odor. Smugglers would rather smuggle something more condensed, less odoriferous and more profitable with less risk.Sadly, drug testing boosts the use of hard drugs and alcohol. Hard drugs and alcohol can be in and out of one's system in a weekend. Cannabis leaves metabolites (not cannabis or cannabinoids, but something created from the metabolism of it) in the system for a while that show it was consumed and metabolized.... even from weeks before.
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Comment #139 posted by FoM on July 22, 2007 at 05:46:25 PT
For Those Interested
This is a long article and I thought some here might want to read it. Why does he call his followers wackos?The Antiwar, Anti-Abortion, Anti-Drug-Enforcement-
Administration, Anti-Medicare Candidacy of Dr. Ron Paul http://www.nytimes.com/2007/07/22/magazine/22Paul-t.htmlNYT Sunday Preview: Ron Paul for President -- Of the 'Wackos'?http://www.mediainfo.com/eandp/news/article_display.jsp?vnu_content_id=1003614862
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Comment #138 posted by whig on July 22, 2007 at 00:04:46 PT
unkat27
Bill Richardson passed medical marijuana in New Mexico. No other candidate for president has done more for us.
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Comment #137 posted by whig on July 22, 2007 at 00:03:44 PT
unkat27
I'm sorry things are so hard in Massachusetts. I know it is bad in Pennsylvania, where I am from and have only been away from barely a year. Those states like California where medical cannabis is legal had to do it themselves, the federal government is not helping us they are actively trying to prevent us. Hillary Clinton and John Edwards have said they will call off federal raids on states with medical marijuana.This does not end cannabis prohibition in Massachusetts. That can't be done by any president. Congress should and must change the laws but until that happens you cannot expect the president to act as supreme legislator.Massachusetts should end cannabis prohibition, support medical marijuana and/or alcohol-marijuana equalization or come up with another approach. Some people are going to have to take a stand in your state, one way or another.
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Comment #136 posted by FoM on July 21, 2007 at 13:01:25 PT
 unkat27 
We aren't divided. We have always been different. We can be wanting the same thing but we see our own way and that's what it should be like. If anyone pushes me I will turn my hearing aid down and I think lots of people are that way. We should respect each other and let our differences add color to CNews.
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Comment #135 posted by observer on July 21, 2007 at 11:42:55 PT
Cannabis easy to find?
I live in Mass on the east coast and cannabis is NOT easy to find by any means whatsoever. It is a risky hunt in which you always have to watch your back and never know when somebody is gonna rat you out to the cops. If you get caught, if you have a prior record, you could lose everything and do hard prison time, depending on how leniant the judge is, and the way it works, they usually appoint the guys with records to the hardest judges.It is the same story in Maryland, D.C., and Virginia. In the "Bible belt" especially, the whole legal system, philosophy and religion* is geared to rooting out and punishing pot smokers. Pot isn't easy to find. And if you do find it, it is way too expensive. Over $400 for an ounce wasn't uncommon near D.C. (Of course, it all depends on who you know.) So no, pot really isn't easy to find all over the U.S.A. ___* Court watchers keep tabs on judges, Fri, Jul. 20, 2007, 
http://www.kansascity.com/255/story/198087.html
 John Becknell observes court proceedings as part of an anti-drug program called Court Watch designed to hold the Manchester, Ky., justice system accountable in drug cases.Becknell, a devout Christian known to many as "Brother John," pulls out a pen and an inch-thick docket, mostly of drug and alcohol cases. For the next three hours, he takes diligent notes on the judge's actions, the attendance of police officers and so on.The purpose? To make sure drug offenders 
[read: pot smokers]
in eastern Kentucky are getting what they deserve...The Rev. Doug Abner, pastor at Community Church -- whose slogan for a 2004 anti-drug march was "Get Saved or Get Busted" -- said the presence of Court Watch volunteers puts "mild pressure" on judges "to do the right thing." The volunteers collect information for a database and look for trends in drug crimes
[read: to stick it to pot smokers]...Ken Bolin, pastor at Manchester Baptist Church, said he supports Court Watch and sees no reason why churches and courts can't work together to combat drug offenders
[read: pot smokers].
http://www.kansascity.com/255/story/198087.html
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Comment #134 posted by unkat27 on July 21, 2007 at 11:40:17 PT
Paul is Genuine, Popular Dems Same old BS
It burns me that they can split people like us by saying, "You can either have universal healthcare or you can have medical cannabis, but you can't have both."Why can't we have both? Ron Paul is all in favor of legal cannabis for all. I haven't heard any dems, except Kucinich and Gravel, publicly favor legal cannabis, and those 2 are considered underdogs. Neither Obama or Clinton have said anything about the issue of cannabis, and they are considered front-runners. Ron Paul has been voted online as the most popular candidate of the republican party, but the MSM has completely ignored and buried this fact, because whether people realize it or not, he does NOT work for the corporations. He's an antiwar libertarian that wants the US OUT OF IRAQ NOW! Meanwhile, Obama and Clinton are actually worried about not giving Israel's Jewish Zionist Party enough support, and are buying and pitching the same undertones of fear-mongering that could lead us into a larger war with Iran. Meanwhile, to gain voter support while they court Jewish Zionist's big money, they pretend to be in favor of Universal Healthcare, one of the most popular domestic issues on the agenda. Yeah, I've heard that shit before. I'll believe that they're sincere when they stop accepting big money from the same corporations and big pigs that gave us the war on terror and the mess in Iraq.
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Comment #133 posted by FoM on July 21, 2007 at 10:26:21 PT
unkat27 
I haven't seen either party do what they promise they will do. What ever happened to being a compassionate conservative? Politicans are a breed all their own and most people are just ordinary people trying to get by. I believe a politician as far as I can throw him. I put my hopes in the people, the Internet including YouTube to keep them honest this time. The Internet has only come into it's own in the last few years and we will change the world. I thank the hippies for not quitting but pushing into technology and the Net. Maybe We the People will mean something soon.
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Comment #132 posted by unkat27 on July 21, 2007 at 10:14:53 PT
Universal Healhcare and dems
As for the universal healthcare issue, imo, the dems are just supporting it cuz they know that's what the voters want. They always do that. Doesn't mean a thing. Just becuz they say so, doesn't mean they'll keep that promise. I've lost count of the times dem candidates have broken promises after being elected.
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Comment #131 posted by FoM on July 21, 2007 at 09:57:26 PT
 unkat27 
I'm not from California. I never heard of a shortage but then what do I really know. I was putting more emphasis on health care and maybe I generalized too much.
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Comment #130 posted by unkat27 on July 21, 2007 at 09:35:12 PT
FoM, #109
-- "The way I look at it Cannabis can be found anywhere anytime but lack of health care could wipe out all that people have worked for if they get a serious illness and if you don't have insurance because you are uninsurable you can lose your home."Cannabis can be found anywhere anytime? Since when? Has it been legalized when I was sleeping? I don't think you're really thinking about the bigger picture. I live in Mass on the east coast and cannabis is NOT easy to find by any means whatsoever. It is a risky hunt in which you always have to watch your back and never know when somebody is gonna rat you out to the cops. If you get caught, if you have a prior record, you could lose everything and do hard prison time, depending on how leniant the judge is, and the way it works, they usually appoint the guys with records to the hardest judges.It's just like I figured, isn't it? You people in California are spoiled by easy access and don't really give a damn about the rest of us poor fools in the other states, where we continue to be treated like hard criminals just for wanting to use cannabis. Thanks for the support.I don't really think ya'll lucky folks in California care if cannabis is legalized or not, becuz ya'll don't have to worry as long as you live in California. That's what i see.
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Comment #129 posted by whig on July 20, 2007 at 18:44:32 PT
FoM
I know we don't see everything the same and we shouldn't, but in the end it's not up to us it's up to who can build the largest coalition of support and win the primary. I think that any Democratic candidate likely to gain the nomination will be better than any Republican candidate, including Ron Paul, even though I do hope he gets the Republican nomination.
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Comment #128 posted by FoM on July 20, 2007 at 17:04:31 PT
Just My Opinion
I don't see things like everyone. That's why we are all different. Whig, Edwards is a nice person and so is Richardson and so are all the Democrats this time around. Hillary is at the bottom of the list but because of what she said I can handle her.
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Comment #127 posted by whig on July 20, 2007 at 16:53:41 PT
FoM
My first choice for president would have to be Bill Richardson if he has a chance, because he has actually done something for us and proven himself.
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Comment #126 posted by mayan on July 20, 2007 at 16:50:15 PT
FoM
You said... "For the first time today I would be happy with a Clinton Obama ticket. It could be good for many reasons. A woman and a black man. It's really is something when you think about it."I know the greedy corporations that are wrecking our country would be very happy. 
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Comment #125 posted by whig on July 20, 2007 at 16:36:27 PT
FoM
I'd actually prefer John Edwards to Hillary Clinton. If Ohio's vote hadn't been stolen he'd be the VP right now.
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Comment #124 posted by FoM on July 20, 2007 at 14:54:21 PT
whig
I am doing a lot of thinking today. Ever since Senator Clinton said what she said I have softened my opinion of her. She isn't Obama though. I just love Obama and this is why. I am a woman and he is adorable. He is charming. He looks like a knight in shining armor. He is an Irish Kenyan. He is familiar with Moslems and Christians. Young people see hope when they see him. In a way electing Barrick Obama would be the end of a terrible time in history and a black man would become the leader. It's a romantic attachment more then picking his politics apart. This is how little I look beyond my heart. I said that to say this. For the first time today I would be happy with a Clinton Obama ticket. It could be good for many reasons. A woman and a black man. It's really is something when you think about it.
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Comment #123 posted by FoM on July 20, 2007 at 12:48:09 PT
whig
I'm sure you know this but never ever have a heavy picture over the head of your bed. 
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Comment #122 posted by whig on July 20, 2007 at 12:24:11 PT
DjLoTi
It's kind of fascinating, I wouldn't say fun. If it's a small enough quake that it won't hurt anyone, it's one thing, but you don't really know how big the quake is until it hits so you have to be mainly concerned for safety.
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Comment #121 posted by DjLoTi on July 20, 2007 at 12:14:52 PT
Earthquake
Now that sounds like fun!
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Comment #120 posted by whig on July 20, 2007 at 12:11:01 PT
FoM
4.2 magnitude is the USGS estimate. I don't think that's very large. We noticed it because it was close by, around Oakland.It's actually an interesting thing, first I felt it coming and said "earthquake" and then it hit. :)
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Comment #119 posted by FoM on July 20, 2007 at 11:10:38 PT
whig
I remember the tremors that followed the North Ridge Quake. It is an amazing sensation that I will never forget. I'm glad you and Mrs. Whig are ok.
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Comment #118 posted by FoM on July 20, 2007 at 11:08:47 PT
whig
I know. I think he would get a good position under whoever becomes President. He is young enough to grow and become very wise. Maybe he then could win in 2016 and we could have 16 years of Dems to fix this mess. I might be dead by then though! LOL!
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Comment #117 posted by whig on July 20, 2007 at 11:07:22 PT
FoM
yes, I felt the earthquake it was a 4.something. Not very large.
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Comment #116 posted by whig on July 20, 2007 at 11:05:13 PT
FoM
If Barack Obama doesn't win he is still a senator and he is young and may grow into a fine candidate in 2012 or 2016 or even much later because he really has his whole career ahead of him.
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Comment #115 posted by whig on July 20, 2007 at 11:02:00 PT
observer
The president is really a figurehead for the people that place him or her in office and maintain his or her public support once in office. In recent history these people have been the wealthy and corporations far more than ordinary people like ourselves with no access to mainstream media.Hillary Clinton has the support of wealthy and corporate sector, there's no doubt. She isn't my first choice to win the primary. But she also knows that we the people have a voice now, and she has pledged not to attack our free states.
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Comment #114 posted by FoM on July 20, 2007 at 10:56:44 PT
Obama
He better had stand up for medical marijuana or someday he will look back and wonder why he didn't win.
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Comment #113 posted by FoM on July 20, 2007 at 10:54:18 PT
whig
Did you feel the earthquake?
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Comment #112 posted by whig on July 20, 2007 at 10:51:41 PT
unkat27
Not only are the Democrats in favor of some form of universal health care, I think all of them except Barack Obama and Joe Biden have said they would end the federal raids on states with medical marijuana.
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Comment #111 posted by FoM on July 20, 2007 at 10:19:54 PT
observer 
The Republicans are the ones that love locking up people that is true. Health care should be universal and that would include people in prison. Universal means everyone. I don't mind paying more taxes to have at least health care like the VA. That would do just fine.
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Comment #110 posted by observer on July 20, 2007 at 10:11:20 PT
politics is politics
The way I look at it, the best health care system in the world doesn't apply to people in jail. When you're in jail, government doesn't give you much medical care, at all. They just let you die from cancer, infections, whatever. Maybe a doc visit before you croak, so they can say, "but we gave him/her medical care" with a straight face. So, keeping people out of prison is best for their health. That way, they can actually get health care, instead of getting a bunch of diseases in prison like TB, or AIDS. The most shiny and glittering promises for the bestest health care in the west won't do you any good when you're dying in jail from untreated cancer or HIV or TB, because Billary Clinton decided to sacrifice pot smokers for politics. Billary did that once before in the 1990s, I recall. So why would not Hillary and Bill do it once again? Politics is (Machiavellian) Politics. If you ask me, the Clintons' actions (locking up millions of pot smokers) speak far louder than their political promises not to once more jail tokers for the very same political reasons. see: http://spr.org Stop Prison Rape 
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Comment #109 posted by FoM on July 20, 2007 at 08:53:17 PT
unkat27
I think all of the Democrats running for President want some form of Universal Health Care but no Republicans do. I know you are addressing Whig but they had an earthquake out there around 4:30 am and maybe his electric is messed up. The way I look at it Cannabis can be found anywhere anytime but lack of health care could wipe out all that people have worked for if they get a serious illness and if you don't have insurance because you are uninsurable you can lose your home. I am not alone. You can't get treatment either anymore because you just can't unless you have insurance.
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Comment #108 posted by unkat27 on July 20, 2007 at 07:59:08 PT
Whig
Okay, we both know that universal healthcare is the best course.So, what candidate or prospective candidate is promoting universal healthcare? I haven't been following it closely enough, so I don't know of any. Do you?If there aren't any, then consider how much the situation would improve if cannabis were legalized and people who turn to it as a medicine never had to fear being imprisoned again. Consider what it would be like to be able to grow yer own and not have to worry about being ratted on by nosey neighbors.i think that is something worth voting for, even when all of the issues don't quite pan out the way we want all at once.
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Comment #107 posted by Hope on July 20, 2007 at 07:46:10 PT
Willie Nelson is ok.
Thank you, DjLoTi. That's good to know.
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Comment #106 posted by DjLoTi on July 20, 2007 at 01:08:07 PT
Ron Paul radio and Willie Nelson
go to RonPaulradio.comWillie Nelson is fine, he's scheduled to play soon in Austin. 
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Comment #105 posted by whig on July 19, 2007 at 23:30:09 PT
Sinsemilla Jones
I want to point out also that John Edwards said some time ago he would end the federal raids on states with medical marijuana, and Mike Gravel is for legalization.
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Comment #104 posted by whig on July 19, 2007 at 23:27:34 PT
unkat27
You cannot make a profit on providing health care to some people no matter how much you lower the costs (and how?). Some of us are just pure financial cost. The free market is not designed to work in this case.
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Comment #103 posted by Sinsemilla Jones on July 19, 2007 at 23:03:53 PT
Thanks whig!
I had lost track, and nothing I hear or read about Edwards and Gravel ever puts former in front of Senator. I know Biden's still in the Senate, though, so he should have voted on Coburn but for some reason didn't.
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Comment #102 posted by unkat27 on July 19, 2007 at 22:15:01 PT
Whig, #100
-- "You cannot fix health care by raising incomes."No, but it might be possible by lowering healthcare costs at the same time. There's something known as a slide-rule method that could also lower the costs.Universal healthcare is probably best, but it might be unrealistic to expect that kind of change too quickly. There are other ways to make healthcare more affordable.Ron Paul may not have all the best answers, but I think his antiwar, anti-imperialist, pro-trade position, and his pro-cannabis position are something worth considering in a compromise with the other issues.As for the abortion issue, with Roe vs Wade, I still think that will be a legislative decision, not a judicial one. The Judicial branch does not make law, it only enforces it.
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Comment #101 posted by FoM on July 19, 2007 at 21:33:11 PT
unkat27
I read that one more Judge being appointment could overturn Roe Vs. Wade. I doubt a Democrat as President would appoint someone like that when the time comes. Ron Paul has many good points but he just isn't concerned with what is important to me. I don't think his ideas would change how the Republicans are. The most important thing is that we all can believe like we want and it should be ok. We aren't electing a savior just a president.
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Comment #100 posted by whig on July 19, 2007 at 21:28:43 PT
unkat27 #98
I don't want to get too far off topic here but I think Michael Moore is correct we need to take the profit out of health care. It doesn't matter how much money you make or have if you are sick you would spend every penny and if someone you loved was sick you would sell everything you owned if you had to. You cannot fix health care by raising incomes.
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Comment #99 posted by whig on July 19, 2007 at 21:24:29 PT
Hope #80
I think you might be going a little bit further than I would. There are people who stockpile explosives, for instance, endangering their neighbors if not properly stored and if not intended for a proper purpose might be a threat to public safety.
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Comment #98 posted by unkat27 on July 19, 2007 at 21:11:05 PT
FoM, #42
-- "If a pro life person got in power in the republican party they could appoint judges that think similarly and we could go back to the time when women used coat hangers to end a pregnancy if that was her only choice. That's not good."That's funny, cuz i thought G.W. was a pro-lifer. How come he hasn't done it yet?Becuz a president cannot actually over-turn any law he wants to over-turn. That's something left to the legislative branch.As for the medicare and universal health care thing, what you fail to understand is that Ron Paul believes in the "living wage" for everyone, and making a world where everyone can take care of themselves. In other words, it's all about making medicare and universal health care unecessary, by making health-care affordable to all. The reason why medicare exists in the first place is because people that didn't make enough money or were too poor couldn't afford the high costs of health-care. Ron Paul's position begins with the idea that healthcare costs are too high to begin with, and if there truly was more equality, then people wouldn't depend upon the government to pay their bills for them.That starts with a "living wage"; an income rate which takes all the living expenses into account, including healthcare.You see, you have to dig beneath the surface and get to the roots of the system. Of course, when it comes right down to it, Ron Paul's ideas might be impossible to implement as long as the greedy corporate profiteers are more concerned with sustaining their profits than reforming the system for the better of all.
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Comment #97 posted by LaGuardia on July 19, 2007 at 19:09:04 PT
U.S. Mayors Declare Drug War a Failure
"The mayors of America's large cities have unanimously approved a resolution stating that the drug war "has failed" and calling for a harm-reduction oriented approach to drug policy that focuses on public health.The U.S. Conference of Mayors adopted the resolution during its June 21-26 annual meeting in Los Angeles, calling for a "new bottom line" in drug policy that "concentrates more fully on reducing the negative consequences associated with drug abuse, while ensuring that our policies do not exacerbate these problems or create new social problems of their own; establishes quantifiable, short- and long-term objectives for drug policy; saves taxpayers money; and holds state and federal agencies responsible."
U.S. Mayors Declare Drug War a Failure
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Comment #96 posted by mayan on July 19, 2007 at 18:25:00 PT
The Next Prez
If they are backed by the establishment then this country might as well make out it's will. However, we might just be stuck with the bush regime for good... US Ambassador: "Concern that United States 2008 elections will be postponed":
http://tinyurl.com/2xrky8THE WAY OUT IS THE WAY IN...A Wake-up Call - By Paul Craig Roberts:
http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article18037.htmHow the Towers Fell--A Lecture by Richard Gage, AIA, Architect (video):
http://www.911truth.org/article.php?story=20070717215511431White House Gets Defensive Over Accusation Bin Laden Is Dead:
http://prisonplanet.com/articles/july2007/190707binladendead.htmJuly 23, 2007 - 9/11 Truth/Impeachment Show with Robert David Steele & Matthew Sullivan:
http://questioningwar-organizingresistance.blogspot.com/2007/07/july-23-2007-911-truthimpeachment-show.htmlThe Science and the Politics of 9/11 Conference - Madison, Wisconsin - August 3-5:
http://freedomisforeverybody.blogspot.com/2007/07/fwd-science-and-politics-of-911.html"Inside Job?" Plastic Roll Banners Available:
http://911blogger.com/node/10077
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Comment #95 posted by Dankhank on July 19, 2007 at 18:04:59 PT
yes, that's it ...
the "no" symbol sounds good to me ...I don't know what to say about a letter to Mr souder.He likely only answers to his "higher power," and who knows how that let's him spew the hate he spews.Good luck on any attempt.
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Comment #94 posted by PatrioticDissension on July 19, 2007 at 17:52:54 PT:
Hitler and Walters
I'm consdering putting a NO sign. I'm not sure whats its called you know the red circle and slash like on a no smoking sign over the leaf.
walters and hitler
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Comment #93 posted by PatrioticDissension on July 19, 2007 at 17:49:57 PT:
mark souder
Mark Souder is VERY and i mean VERY religious. I've seen the Apostolic church he goes to. I swear these people do not allow members of their church to even watch TV. I'm an ordained reverend. Do you think I could at least make Mark feel bad if I send him a letter of denouncement? Possibly insult his integrity as a person who calls himself Christian too. MMM like a hard kick to the nuts.
John Walters
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Comment #92 posted by Dankhank on July 19, 2007 at 17:46:51 PT
walters/mentor
personally, I'm troubled with the juxtaposition of the swastika and the leaf.don't know how else to do it ... 'cept ...replace the leaf with an eagle?good try, pictures can be powerful ...
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Comment #91 posted by Dankhank on July 19, 2007 at 17:43:03 PT
souder ...
a cynical response to your question might sound like this:only if you knew he sold drugs in high school or college ...:-)I tried to find a non-cynical response, but couldn't ...sorry 
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Comment #90 posted by FoM on July 19, 2007 at 17:41:17 PT
Hope
It took me a year to not have any craving attacks and 2 years to totally be over those crazy things. One day at a time is the best. With any addiction that's the best way to do it. Good luck to you.
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Comment #89 posted by PatrioticDissension on July 19, 2007 at 17:34:35 PT:
OFF TOPIC: Mark Souder
Anyone know who Mark Souder is? He used to be my next door neighbor when i was a kid 17 year or so ago in Grabill Indiana. I wonder if having known him if I could have any sort of influence on him about drugs since hes number 2 only to John Walters as a prohibitionist?
John Walters
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Comment #88 posted by Hope on July 19, 2007 at 17:33:14 PT
Musman Comment 86
I agree. 
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Comment #87 posted by Hope on July 19, 2007 at 17:31:21 PT
Smoked for a few years in my middle twenties
then quit for maybe twelve years...got fat...was headed for another Snickers bar somewhere around forty, when I decided to get cigarettes instead. Been smoking for a few more years this time. A year until it gets better!!?? I've been trying to remember when it got easier. I was thoroughly "quit" and well "quit"...I just chose cigs instead of sweets for my self comforter that day. Reading a book...oddly enough, and holding on with both hands, seems to help the most of anything I can do so far when it really gets aggravating. If the book is interesting enough...my mind forgets the desire to smoke and keeps my hands from inadvertently reaching for a cigarette without thinking. It's amazing how often I tend to start reaching or looking for one without even thinking of it. Especially at the computer.I'm doing ok though. Got to go read and hold a book a bit!
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Comment #86 posted by museman on July 19, 2007 at 17:24:34 PT
Hope#80 
No human being has the right to play God. Period. No Big Brother, no Council or Legislature, no Enforcement or Intelligence Agency, not Doctors, not Lawyers, not self-righteous Aristocrats, nor anyone else who thinks their fortune or station qualifies as 'superior.' Since these I mention are the only ones who actually act like they are part of some special dispensation from God, I don't include the powerless, and less fortunate -those are more likely the victims.
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Comment #85 posted by FoM on July 19, 2007 at 16:55:38 PT
PatrioticDIssension 
It's called passion. Passion doesn't listen to reason.
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Comment #84 posted by FoM on July 19, 2007 at 16:53:08 PT
Hope
I quit for over 10 years so I know how hard it is for you. Hang in there. After the first year it got easier and after two years it didn't bother me at all. I had to lose weight though so that was hard because I ate everything that wasn't bolted down. LOL! Stupid me started smoking again when my son was so sick and now I'm still smoking.
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Comment #83 posted by FoM on July 19, 2007 at 16:47:44 PT
Hope
I don't believe that anyone who experiments with a substance should be arrested and jailed. I drawal the line with sales of hard drugs by a non addict. That is where my conscience said to draw the line. Do no harm is how I feel. People have died from hard drugs and the person has to take some responsibility if they sold the drug to the person that died. I feel the same way about selling dangerous prescription drugs to people by pharmaceutical companies. If a person gets high on Oxycontin as an example and drives and kills someone in an accident they should be held responsible too. 
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Comment #82 posted by Hope on July 19, 2007 at 16:45:02 PT
Quitting tobacco is a gift 
of love to my son.I was going to quit when cannabis was legal anyway. I wasn't counting on having to quit anytime very soon, though. That's for sure. :0)Someone my son loves was diagnosed with incurable lung cancer and the grief and horror he felt spilled over into fear of losing me because of tobacco and I just couldn't press on any further about maintaining my habit. His grief and fear was so real and tangible. I heard it in his voice. I know him. He's my child. My oldest child. He's really, truly, deeply afraid for me, and I cannot argue with that, at this point, because of his friend's situation. His despair was impossible for me to ignore.Smoking tobacco is really a pleasure for me...but one that fails me when I know it causes fear and despair that I can't really alleviate in him in any other way than by quitting. He didn't ask me, too. I personally, am not having any obvious health problems from it. At all. I just had to do this, to help and comfort him, because I love him so much...and maybe it will do me good. It's making me a little crazy and irritated for a while...but it will get easier...and I'll be glad for having done this little thing that suddenly means so hideously very much to someone I love so very much as I love him.
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Comment #81 posted by PatrioticDIssension on July 19, 2007 at 16:29:51 PT:
apologies
i apologize i dont mean to tread on anyones beliefs. But still i think if woman talks about controlling her body what about when they chose not to control it the nite the baby was conceived? she made a choice she knew could result in getting pregnant. 
John Walters and his mentor
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Comment #80 posted by Hope on July 19, 2007 at 16:27:21 PT
About all the jailing and punishing
I've been talking about in this thread.I'm talking about jailing and punishing people for choosing to consume cannabis in particular, and other substances, as well. It's about prohibition of a substance.
 
I'm not saying all prosecution and holding people in cells is wrong.People who assault, murder, rape, steal...should be restrained and kept from terrorizing and hurting and killing others. We have to have traffic laws for safety and keeping things running smoothly...and reasonable fines are appropriate. But persecuting and prosecuting cannabis possession and even possession of real drugs, is going too far.They, prohibitionists, are totally convinced that they are doing the right thing, to pursue and punish others for herb and drug consumption. They are even able, in their power to delude themselves and others, to equate consuming a plant, with murdering another human being. Lots of things in this life are dangerous or risky. Some people are even attracted to them. They always have been and they always will be.Prohibitionists and government..don't consider driving a car equal to murder or possible murder, even though many people die hideously in car accidents every day. They don't consider traveling in an automobile, truck, train, airplane, or jet, for pleasure so dangerous and immoral that people should be harshly punished for it. There is real risk and danger in doing those things. Some people choose to do it anyway.What if some parachutist falls out of the sky on me, or my child and causes us death? We better make it a crime and start locking up sky divers and their enablers.They don't consider using natural gas or electricity a crime...yet it certainly can kill. They don't consider owning an Oleander plant a crime, yet they will attack and hurt you, badly, for having the wrong sort of poppy plant or cacti...or the herb, cannabis. They go too far when they criminalize people because of plants. People should have a right to have even pills and powders...even truly dangerous stuff, if they want to or feel they need to. Harsh punishment for possessing these things doesn't seem right, to me. I don't think that others should even have the right to confiscate any of those things from you, as an adult, even if they THINK it's for your own good. People should raise their children to be knowledgeable, and cautious of danger. We should be able to caution others of dangers. But we shouldn't be able to force other adults or other peoples children not to participate in a sport or anything because we wish to make their choices for them...or even insist on it..just because we don't want them to do what they choose to do, because of our fears or doubts. Should the police be called in if your grown neighbor wishes to learn to sky dive?People have to have some choices and power about their own lives. They have to or it's not really living. It's hardly even existing. 
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Comment #79 posted by whig on July 19, 2007 at 16:21:50 PT
High-THC Turmeric
http://tinyurl.com/268eeeI think this is really good to tell people about because the prohibitionists are going to lose their shit when people can just smoke spices off the grocery shelf for their medicinal needs, even though it isn't cannabis and doesn't substitute for cannabis.
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Comment #78 posted by whig on July 19, 2007 at 16:09:19 PT
Vaporize
The THC* in turmeric vaporizes at the same temperature as the THC in cannabis.*THC in turmeric is tetrahydrocurcumin, not tetrahydrocannabinol.
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Comment #77 posted by whig on July 19, 2007 at 16:05:45 PT
Hope
I think you should try some turmeric, it's seeming to help clear my sinuses finally (I am using both cannabis and turmeric together now) and it is supposed to be very good for treating damage caused by tobacco.
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Comment #76 posted by whig on July 19, 2007 at 16:01:11 PT
Likewise
Mike Gravel hasn't been a senator for decades.
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Comment #75 posted by whig on July 19, 2007 at 16:00:17 PT
Sinsemilla Jones
John Edwards is not presently in the Senate so could not vote for or against anything.
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Comment #74 posted by Sinsemilla Jones on July 19, 2007 at 15:57:35 PT
The Coburn Amendment
In April, 2007 Senators Clinton, Dodd, and Obama voted against the Coburn amendment, which, if enacted, could put medical marijuana patients and caregivers at even greater risk than they already face and could be used by opponents to attempt to shut down state medical marijuana programs across the country.Senators Biden, Edwards, and Gravel have neither cosponsored nor voted on any legislation specifically addressing medical marijuana.http://granitestaters.com/candidates/So apparently while they say they would end the raids, Biden, Edwards, and even Gravel managed not to vote on the Coburn amendment.
Medical Marijuana Voting Guide
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Comment #73 posted by whig on July 19, 2007 at 15:57:12 PT
RRG
I think Bill Richardson is a good man and I would be glad if he won.
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Comment #72 posted by RevRayGreen on July 19, 2007 at 15:55:43 PT
There is one man running
who has put his pen to paper providing legal protection
for medical marijuana patients, has the stones to grow
marijuana and provided state distribution for those with
as a legal source to obtain their medicine.So will the DEA raid a State of New Mexico facility ?I'm going to ask Bill next time I meet him how he thinks the feds will react. Last time he did tell me when I first
met him, kinda pull me to the side and said "When I'm President every state will have protection"..after hearing my tale of insufferable, informal fools in office here in Iowa as I was getting his autograph signed with quote"It's the right thing to do".
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Comment #71 posted by FoM on July 19, 2007 at 15:47:45 PT
Sinsemilla Jones 
Thank goodness for small miracles. I don't want to see the end of the RP but I want them to at least get in sync with the people in this time in history. They act like they want the 50s back or something. It ain't gonna happen.
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Comment #70 posted by whig on July 19, 2007 at 15:44:39 PT
Hope
Will you give me your blessing?
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Comment #69 posted by whig on July 19, 2007 at 15:43:40 PT
Hope #65
The church, the state, the government.
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Comment #68 posted by whig on July 19, 2007 at 15:43:04 PT
Tower of Babel
Mistranslations lead people astray.
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Comment #67 posted by Sam Adams on July 19, 2007 at 15:43:04 PT
Ron Paul
too bad about the abortion stance. Doesn't really fit with the less-government-is-better mentality. Butt out of a woman's or a family's affairs, that is less government. And please, don't let the Pope dictate our lives, that is not small government.Mike Gravel sounds interesting, he was a senator from Alaska. There are not many former senators who want to legalize.Too bad it all comes down to money. Whoever has the most money is president. That's what the media taught me.
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Comment #66 posted by Sinsemilla Jones on July 19, 2007 at 15:41:14 PT
There are 3 Rs, btw
Rep. Tom Tancredo (R-CO) has consistently voted in favor of the Hinchey-Rohrabacher amendment.andOn June 5, 2007, in Manchester, New Hampshire, former Maryland statehouse delegate Don Murphy asked Gov. Tommy Thompson (R-WI) if he would end the federal raids on state medical marijuana programs. Thompson responded by jabbing Murphy in the chest with his two fingers and loudly saying, "No, they should not be arrested! They should not be arrested. They should not be arrested. I would do away with the DEA raids."Not that I'm promoting Rs or anything, I just think it's nice. I had no idea any of them besides Ron Paul had a lick of sense.http://granitestaters.com/candidates/
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Comment #65 posted by Hope on July 19, 2007 at 15:40:07 PT
Whig, What do you think he meant?
"Every plant, which my heavenly Father hath not planted, shall be rooted up." He was talking about something besides plants in this instance, I think.
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Comment #64 posted by whig on July 19, 2007 at 15:38:14 PT
Hope
Nice version here.http://www.v-a.com/bible/matthew-15.htmlKJV isn't always good. 11. "It is not what enters the mouth that debases* the human being,
except what comes out of the mouth,
that is what debases the human being."12. Then his disciples came to him and told him, Do you know that the Pharisees, who heard this manifestation took offense?"13. However, he replied and told them, "Whichever plant that my Father in heaven did not plant, shall be uprooted.
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Comment #63 posted by observer on July 19, 2007 at 15:37:36 PT
Ron Paul
I have no idea whatsoever if Ron Paul is a nice man or not. I do like most of his policies, especially Ron Paul's strong support for medical cannabis and freedom, so that is why I avidly follow news about him, and I support him and those like him. Cannabis policy and especially government leaders who want to lock people up for using cannabis, that is a huge issue for me. Here on cannabisnews.com marijuana law reform really is the focus for me. 
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Comment #62 posted by FoM on July 19, 2007 at 15:36:59 PT
Sinsemilla Jones 
I really like Mike Gravel. I wish the world was full of people like him. He is one smart and very wise man.
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Comment #61 posted by whig on July 19, 2007 at 15:33:37 PT
Hope
Matthew 15:11 Not that which goeth into the mouth defileth a man; but that which cometh out of the mouth, this defileth a man. 12 Then came his disciples, and said unto him, Knowest thou that the Pharisees were offended, after they heard this saying? 13 But he answered and said, Every plant, which my heavenly Father hath not planted, shall be rooted up. 
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Comment #60 posted by Sinsemilla Jones on July 19, 2007 at 15:29:36 PT
unkat #37 - Don't forget Mike Gravel!
"Ron Paul is the ONLY candidate that favors legal cannabis and has had no politcal fears of admitting it in a public forum."During an interview on C-SPAN on May 1, 2007, Sen. Gravel announced that he would end marijuana prohibition altogether if he becomes president. A caller asked, "What do you think about legalizing marijuana?" Sen. Gravel replied, "The answer to that is real simple. I would legalize marijuana."http://granitestaters.com/candidates/mike_gravel.html
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Comment #59 posted by Hope on July 19, 2007 at 15:29:26 PT
Whig, comment 52
Right. I'm just saying that choosing to do so, and consuming something, even if it turns out to be deadly or sickening, should not be a "crime" that someone, or a group of someones, can punish another for. 
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Comment #58 posted by whig on July 19, 2007 at 15:27:40 PT
Morality
I believe war is evil.
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Comment #57 posted by whig on July 19, 2007 at 15:26:11 PT
observer
I hope Ron Paul wins the Republican nomination.
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Comment #56 posted by FoM on July 19, 2007 at 15:25:08 PT
observer 
I really believe that Ron Paul is a nice man. I just don't like most of his politics so that's why I am not interested in him. Cannabis is only a small part of this for me. I have more issues then marijuana reform.
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Comment #55 posted by whig on July 19, 2007 at 15:23:32 PT
PatrioticDissension
I am religious.You are entitled to practice your moral beliefs, and respect mine. If someone has a moral belief that is different from yours and you force them to act in accordance with your belief, they will not become believers.You have to let people choose for themselves to believe what is true, and trust God to not lead people astray when they seek the truth.
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Comment #54 posted by observer on July 19, 2007 at 15:21:30 PT
How about that Ron Paul !
Obama? What about Ron Paul?
Ron Paul is the ONLY candidate that favors legal cannabis and has had no politcal fears of admitting it in a public forum. Ron Paul is the ONLY candidate that is completely antiwar and willing to admit it in a public forum (aside from Kucinich).That's right. Ron Paul is the pro-freedom, pro medical cannabis candidate. The others candidates mouth mealymouthed and non-committal lukewarm words to appease an angry electorate. An electorate who they know they want medical cannabis to be available, as an option, says poll after poll. Ron Paul came out swinging for cannabis and freedom to take it long before the others talked it over with their advisers and committies and held their political fingers to the wind.Ron Paul takes bipartisan flak continually, from both sides of the aisle. Democrats hate how Ron Paul won't go along on their (perhaps well-intentioned) social programs that he can't find in the Constitution. Republicans hate how Ron Paul won't go along with their (perhaps well-intentioned) torturous imperial military adventures and fascist police state wet dreams that he can't find in the Constitution. But, on the other hand, many of us think he's doing everything just right. Go figure. Win, lose or whatever, Ron Paul is getting the message of freedom and limited government out, and into the ears of many who would not have otherwise heard him if he hadn't run. And that is a beautiful thing. 
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Comment #53 posted by FoM on July 19, 2007 at 15:19:31 PT
PatrioticDissension 
I have always been a spiritual person and I understand being pro choice. (I am a woman and I am against abortion) God is merciful and He would forgive a woman for making a tough decision so why do we want to make them a criminal? I believe we should judge not or that's how we will be judged so I won't judge since I want mercy in my life for my failures. If the RP is for small government what is the mess we are in now?
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Comment #52 posted by whig on July 19, 2007 at 15:17:22 PT
Hope
That's e-coli, not spinach that's dangerous though. Anything can be contaminated.
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Comment #51 posted by Hope on July 19, 2007 at 15:15:13 PT
Whig Comment 50
Remember last summer when people got sick and a few died from spinach contaminated with E-Coli...I think, it was.
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Comment #50 posted by whig on July 19, 2007 at 15:10:26 PT
Hope
Spinach might kill you?
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Comment #49 posted by PatrioticDissension on July 19, 2007 at 15:10:17 PT:
good and bad
since im religious im for banning abortion except in emergencies but my sister's on medicaid so that would cause her a lot of grief. still R.P. is all for small government and the most pot friendly candidate around.Want to see John Walters's rolemodel?
Walters and his mentor
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Comment #48 posted by Hope on July 19, 2007 at 15:08:17 PT
Comment 38
"I don't want the government making more criminals."I so agree. They criminalize and make new criminals at the stroke of a pen.It seems that government has become nothing but making new crimes and making criminals out of more and more people that weren't criminals at all, until the lawmakers and supporters pronounced their law. Some people are profiting from persecuting, prosecuting, testing, and locking people away and re-educating them. Their lives are even all about it and that profit. They are profiting on the backs of those they persecute. It's so horrible and wrong, and I cannot understand how some people can continue to delude themselves into thinking all this criminalizing is a good thing. How wickedly deluded are they?It's insane. It's been insane a long time. Why can't they understand it's what they do to others that makes them, or their behavior, bad or good, or right or wrong....not what they consume? What I might choose to consume might make me sick. It might even kill me (spinach comes to mind) and it might seem a vile substance to some, or even me. But I'm sure that consumption does not make me an evil person or bad person in any way, nor would God suddenly find me worthless and worthy of shunning or punishment because of consuming something. Another human should have no right whatsoever to demand that another should be punished for consuming something that they didn't steal or hurt anyone to get. The only thing that should be considered as a crime punishable by the state as far as consuming something is concerned...is if a person kills and consumes another human being. Cannibalism. Consuming one of your own kind. Not talking here about a Donner's Pass type situation where people consumed other already dead people to survive. Even then, it must be tried and proven that no murder was involved. I think I'd rather die than consume another's flesh...but I could only truly "judge" another, for the killing part.I would consider stealing and consuming something that belonged to someone else, wrong. It would be the stealing that made it the wrong thing to do.In a way...the way this prohibition is handled...THEY, the prohibitionists, are "consuming" other humans, and their lives...like some sort of societal cannibals. 
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Comment #47 posted by whig on July 19, 2007 at 15:08:09 PT
Also
Rush Limbaugh started out in Pittsburgh (he used the call name Jeff Christie at the time).
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Comment #46 posted by whig on July 19, 2007 at 15:05:24 PT
Btw
Ron Paul is from Pittsburgh, actually Dormont which is a neighborhood in the South Hills.
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Comment #45 posted by FoM on July 19, 2007 at 14:51:47 PT
unkat27
Ron Paul wants Roe Vs. Wade oveturned and want Medicare and Medicaid to stop. He is also against universal health care. I wasn't sure if you knew that.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ron_Paul
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Comment #44 posted by FoM on July 19, 2007 at 14:48:00 PT
The GCW
Thank you and I also liked the first letter about national health care.
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Comment #43 posted by The GCW on July 19, 2007 at 14:39:29 PT
Dirty Laundry
The milking cow If you have any hopes for the Bush administration to pull out of Iraq, don't hold your breath. Iraq has been a big milking cow — $450-plus billion dollars so far and growing — for the Bush administrations "friends," so you think they are going to give that up? For example, a recent documentary, Iraq for Sale, revealed, among many other things, that the government has been paying Haliburton/KBR $100 for each bag of laundry it washes for our troops in the field. According to interviews, troops are not allowed to wash their own laundry. Let's just work that out with some quick math: 130,000 troops in Iraq times $100 per bag of laundry works out to $13 million dollars paid to Cheney's ex-company, Haliburton/KBR, each week. That's $676 million per year — just for laundry. No wonder this war is so expensive. It is also easy to see how the Iraq war became the most privatized war ever. So do not fool yourself. This is not a war to fight terrorism or to spread democracy, but a privatized war for corporate profit using American taxpayers' money and our soldiers' blood. Thomas Husted/Kailua, HI http://www.boulderweekly.com/letters.html
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Comment #42 posted by FoM on July 19, 2007 at 14:31:25 PT
unkat27
If a pro life person got in power in the republican party they could appoint judges that think similarly and we could go back to the time when women used coat hangers to end a pregnancy if that was her only choice. That's not good.
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Comment #41 posted by unkat27 on July 19, 2007 at 14:28:36 PT
FoM
Ron Paul may be against abortion, but that doesn't mean he can change the laws if he was president. On the other hand, it would send a powerful message to the nation if a man like him, in favor of legal cannabis and opposed to imperial foreign policies and wars, beat out all the other war-mongers and corporate puppets.I don't really think Paul wants to hurt women, he just wants to discourage abortion. That's not such a bad thing. They should use contraceptives more if they don't want kids. 
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Comment #40 posted by FoM on July 19, 2007 at 14:28:10 PT
Hope
Analyzing ourselves is a good thing. We should know why we believe we are right and if we can't come to grips with our own answers then we should consider the error of our ways. We go thru life and live and learn and that is about all we can do. I have never met a person that is always right or that is always wrong. There are many shades of gray in all our lives.
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Comment #39 posted by Hope on July 19, 2007 at 14:16:48 PT
FoM
I pray about it every day, I think.Today I thought, in a fit of humility, and making sure I still had it, humility, that is...that I should really consider the possibility that I'm wrong and what I should do about it.I can imagine that I am wrong and it makes me sad and ashamed and sorry...but when I look at the cold facts...I am assured in my mind, my heart, my intellect, or whatever, that what is done in the name of these prohibitions is truly wrong and must be resisted and brought down, if possible.I have to consider the possibility of being wrong...to stay confident that I'm part of the right thing to do about it all.Considering that possibility...I'm humbled...deeply...but reassured, ultimately. It's necessary, I believe, to check my path very, very carefully every now and then.
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Comment #38 posted by FoM on July 19, 2007 at 14:12:20 PT
unkat27 
He is a good man but he wants woman to be criminalized again if they have an abortion. I don't want the government making more criminals. I am against abortion but I won't decide what is right or wrong for another woman since I can't walk in her shoes.
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Comment #37 posted by unkat27 on July 19, 2007 at 13:58:38 PT
Obama? What about Ron Paul?
Ron Paul is the ONLY candidate that favors legal cannabis and has had no politcal fears of admitting it in a public forum. Ron Paul is the ONLY candidate that is completely antiwar and willing to admit it in a public forum (aside from Kucinich). That has to be why the corporate media has ignored him and is trying to bury him. He doesn't work for them and doesn't want their blood-money!
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Comment #36 posted by FoM on July 19, 2007 at 13:57:51 PT
Hope
If I believed I was wrong I would stop. I can't do something that would cause injury to anyone. I actually didn't care about cannabis for many years so it isn't something that I would have to pursue if it was wrong. I pray about this subject and so far I haven't felt inclined to think that this is the wrong path. If ever it shows that it is the wrong path I will find something else to do that might help. Great comment Hope.
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Comment #35 posted by Hope on July 19, 2007 at 13:55:42 PT
I would be ashamed.
Deeply ashamed. I would be so sorry.
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Comment #34 posted by Hope on July 19, 2007 at 13:53:41 PT
"....treated like an animal"
Make that "treated like a despised animal".
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Comment #33 posted by Hope on July 19, 2007 at 13:50:22 PT
It's hard to be humble. Humility is hard.
Thinking about humility today. Something to think about. What if we're wrong? What if we were misled, deluded, and deceived and we are wrong about cannabis prohibition?If I came to know that, how would I feel? How should I feel? How would I deal with it?I made myself think of it. To really consider the possibility and take it in.I would be ashamed. Deeply ashamed. And I would be sorry. I would be very sorry.It was hard to truly, really consider that possibility. Very hard.What if it's really ok for people who use cannabis or have anything to with it, to be bound, tormented, and put in jail and prison cells, fined, prosecuted and persecuted .... because of cannabis use? What if it's the right thing for them to be, sometimes, even killed, for the sake of prohibiting the plant? What if it's right to take the "offenders" homes, cars, money and everything they own? What if it's the truly right thing to do?What if cannabis really is a horrible and awful thing and will actually destroy people who have anything to do with it? What if the feeling that a person gets from consuming the plant is really a hideous, heinous, dangerous, sinful, immoral thing? A moral catastrophe? Really consider it.It's the right thing to make people pee in a cup for someone else, and let them cut hunks out of their hair, and saliva out of your mouth, and blood out of your veins, for testing to see what they've "done"...consumed... and quiz deeply into their private life, as a requirement to hire them to work for them? Or because they can, because they are an agent of a government or insurance company or anything? It's the law and it's a good...almost "holy" law. Doing what they do to people because of these laws is just their job and there is absolutely nothing wrong with it. They're just doing their job...and it's a righteous service they are performing for all mankind. It's actually a good thing for them to do that to other people. Consider that prohibition and all that it involves is good and that it really is for "their own good"...and to "save" the perp from something truly terrible. Horribly terrible? More terrible than being arrested and treated like an animal and having their lives as they want it, destroyed?What if it's right to shame and frighten some people so badly about it that they commit suicide? What if they are right and we are wrong? And we had to admit it?It would be very, very hard to say, "I was wrong. I am so ashamed. I am so sorry."I tried it, on the real consideration and possibility that I, and we, are wrong.We're wrong and it's really the right thing, the truly righteous thing to do, to arrest and shackle people for things like drug or herb consumption. Making sure they get a public criminal record that will haunt them and hold them back for the rest of their lives is really the righteous thing to do. It's for their own good.It's the Godly thing to do to fine them and hold them in cells and cages. It doesn't matter what they say. Everything about the War on Drugs and the War on Cannabis is right. It's right to break people's doors down and terrify them, and their families, pets, and neighbors, sometimes to death, because they might be peddling or growing a substance that a bunch of people have decided to be contraband to the people.It's really right to look into and touch and expose people's vaginas and anuses for a drug that they might be sumuggling or consuming. What if we are wrong and the substances they prohibit, even cannabis, are truly, really evil things, and they are doing the right thing and protecting people and their "children", because they might make the wrong choice?What if we have to say "I was wrong", "I'm ashamed", "I'm sorry"?I'm serious. I've eaten this terrible slice of humble pie. It's hard to digest. Sickeningly so. A "Darkest night of the soul" type of thing.
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Comment #32 posted by FoM on July 19, 2007 at 13:34:28 PT
whig
I hope you are right about even Kucinich winning over the Republicans. I worry though. I really can't emotionally handle the Republicans much longer.
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Comment #31 posted by FoM on July 19, 2007 at 13:32:44 PT
One More Thing
I wouldn't waste my time on the Obama link I posted. I thought that one person was gone but he isn't. I will read other threads but not this one anymore. Just dusting the dirt of my feet and moving on.
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Comment #30 posted by whig on July 19, 2007 at 13:16:57 PT
Also
I think All of the Democratic candidates are pro-choice, pro-worker, and for some form of universal health care.
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Comment #29 posted by whig on July 19, 2007 at 13:14:23 PT
FoM
I think whoever wins the Democratic primary will be elected. Even Dennis Kucinich would probably win against any of the Republicans now.
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Comment #28 posted by whig on July 19, 2007 at 13:13:21 PT
FoM
Do you know who's leading the Republican polls now?NONE OF THE ABOVE.
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Comment #27 posted by FoM on July 19, 2007 at 13:09:55 PT
Whig
I don't like Hillary but I will vote for her above Obama if he doesn't speak out.
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Comment #26 posted by FoM on July 19, 2007 at 13:05:26 PT
whig
He has many more months to address medical marijuana. I like him because he is Pro-Choice and cares about workers and Universal Health Care. If he winds up standing against medical marijuana the other issues that are important to me are also important to other lower level candidates and I will join them or one of them that can beat the Republicans next year. I don't take this as seriously as some. I want the Dems in power not the Republicans or I will quit trying.
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Comment #25 posted by whig on July 19, 2007 at 13:04:50 PT
FoM
The truth is, until now I would rather have had Barack Obama than Hillary Clinton. I would now rather have Hillary Clinton.
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Comment #24 posted by whig on July 19, 2007 at 13:03:23 PT
FoM
That isn't true at all.I did like him.I wanted him to say something, anything that would indicate he was on our side. He always has another chance, and another, and another, if he wants to change his mind.Right now he is saying he does not want to end the raids, he just demurred that it wasn't a high priority for him. Well that's nice, and like you said about certain people, I'll just dust my shoes off.
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Comment #23 posted by FoM on July 19, 2007 at 13:00:01 PT
whig
I understand but you never liked him. I'll give him a chance. I am patient. 
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Comment #22 posted by whig on July 19, 2007 at 12:59:41 PT
FoM
That is not a good start, it is a complete rebuff.
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Comment #21 posted by whig on July 19, 2007 at 12:57:49 PT
FoM
Sen. Obama has said he does not think raiding medical marijuana patients should be a priority for the Justice Department.I now oppose Sen. Obama for president.
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Comment #20 posted by FoM on July 19, 2007 at 12:35:27 PT

Democrats
I know the Dems will win in 08 and Hillary has made her statement so I will vote for her if she gets the nomination. I just really like Obama's personality. I would love to sit and listen to him talk for hours. He loves America and he makes people love America.
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Comment #19 posted by FoM on July 19, 2007 at 12:32:36 PT

jmoran
He still might. If he doesn't he won't win the nomination and Hillary will. To be fair to Obama he is trying to win the nomination and he is fighting against the powerful Clinton machine so he will tread lighter then he would want until he realizes that he will lose unless he pulls out all the stops. No time for playing around I believe.
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Comment #18 posted by jmoran on July 19, 2007 at 12:26:46 PT

Obama
If you read the article carefully you can see he has no intentions of doing anything for medical marijuana. That would have been a statement of a republican.
 
"During a town hall meeting in Laconia, New Hampshire, on June 2, 2007, Sen. Obama was asked if he would continue the federal raids on medical marijuana patients and their caregivers. Sen. Obama responded: "I don't think that should be a top priority of us, raiding people who are using ... medical marijuana. With all the things we've got to worry about, and our Justice Department should be doing, that probably shouldn't be a high priority."I am sorry for an ex drug user that is not the statement he should have made except if he is part of the new world order then it makes since. He should have said I will stop the raids and I will do something about our failed drug war.

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Comment #17 posted by FoM on July 19, 2007 at 12:08:32 PT

whig
This is a good beginning but he didn't commit like Hillary just did.http://granitestaters.com/candidates/barack_obama.html
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Comment #16 posted by FoM on July 19, 2007 at 12:00:20 PT

whig
He will. He must. I am waiting until he gets on one of the Hardball college debates they have in the Fall. That's where it will come up.I've said it before if he stands up for medical marijuana then I will get an Obama for President sign and put it in my yard or a bumper sticker for the car. I won't give any money to his campaign until he says he is for Medical Marijuana. I am patient. If he doesn't get medical marijuana then what else won't he get if elected that is important to me and many others?
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Comment #15 posted by whig on July 19, 2007 at 11:06:07 PT

FoM
I think Barack Obama might be the only Democratic candidate for president who hasn't stated his position at all on medical marijuana.
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Comment #14 posted by FoM on July 19, 2007 at 10:50:00 PT

OT: Obama
I know that I am about the only person here that likes Obama but on this thread they mentioned the ONDCP article from the Washington Post. I have never posted on his blog but it might be a good opportunity to say why Walters was sent to those states if someone wants to give it a try. They must have stopped the flamers that were republicans because it is much more peaceful to read now then it was a few days ago. Hate is such a terrible thing.http://my.barackobama.com/page/community/post_group/ObamaHQ/Ctpv#comments
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Comment #13 posted by Hope on July 19, 2007 at 10:38:28 PT

County Sheriffs,
can keep DEA and other Feds from activities in their counties, I'm sure. Somewhere a few years ago, I read an article about a sheriff in Montana or Wyoming...one of the states that one thinks of as a more independent, western wilderness, strong pioneer type area than some places...completely, legally, stopped DEA and perhaps more fed organizations from operating in and harassing people in his county. It was legal and binding and he was able to keep them from operating in his county without his permission. I don't remember if he was able to do what he did through some part of the state constitution or what.That was back when the feds were always trying to set someone up for something. I'm sure they still are. They were literally luring, and causing people to commit crimes...so they could bust them. First they'd tempt and encourage them into a crime, depending on if it was DEA or ATF, drug or weapons crimes,...then come down like a hammer and demolish them. Entrapment stuff to most sane people. The sheriff said they couldn't "set foot" in the county, or something like that...and he was able to back it up...lawfully.Sheriffs, or other "Peace Officers", that care, and don't want to be "in" on the "festivities" of the federal atrocities and don't want the "festivities" happening in their counties or to their people, constituents, friends, neighbors, and families, need to thoroughly explore all the possibilities there are for them to protect their counties from federal interference. Most state and county and city officials like to cozy up to them, though, I suspect...like they are some sort of star or big shot...and enjoy mutual stroking of each others perverted egos.
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Comment #12 posted by FoM on July 19, 2007 at 10:24:47 PT

Press Release from the Drug Policy Alliance
Protection for Medical Marijuana Patients, But Not for DispensariesThursday, July 19, 2007 http://www.drugpolicy.org/news/071907mmj.cfm

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Comment #11 posted by Sam Adams on July 19, 2007 at 09:42:26 PT

unkat
So true - imagine the original "don't tread on me" flags. They were pissed over a 1-2% tax on tea. Imagine the Colonials' reaction if redcoats broke down the doors of the apothecary and put the owners in chains!
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Comment #10 posted by unkat27 on July 19, 2007 at 09:33:04 PT

Expell the Fascists People!
Hey Californians, don't ya think it's time to start flying the "Don't Tread on Me" flags?The DEA and the federal government DO NOT have authoritative jurisdiction over any state government, they only have political influence, corporate big money, and an small army of dumbed-down fascist dupes that don't know the difference between cause and effect.A big enough protest march from the common people could scare the DEA all the way back to their rat-holes in DC.
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Comment #9 posted by FoM on July 19, 2007 at 09:08:42 PT

Willie
I agree. I expect if I'm still alive when I'm 74 that a rocking chair will be my best friend. 
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Comment #8 posted by E_Johnson on July 19, 2007 at 09:05:00 PT

Willie
How many people his age work that hard? If a 20 year old is canceling gigs then it's a bad sign. If a 74 year old is canceling gigs, then it's about time.
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Comment #7 posted by FoM on July 19, 2007 at 08:17:00 PT

dongenero
I agree.http://www.fear.org/

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Comment #6 posted by dongenero on July 19, 2007 at 08:13:41 PT

asset forfeiture
It's a policy that has been terribly abused and over-reached by the powers that be.As it is often used today, it is state sponsored theft from individual citizens, grossly disproportionate to the infractions.Civil asset forfeiture is a cancer to our freedom and the principals of our country. 
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Comment #5 posted by FoM on July 19, 2007 at 07:34:26 PT

Civil Asset Forfeiture 
Once again money is the motive and if that motive is removed then the war on marijuana would slow down I think.
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Comment #4 posted by Hope on July 19, 2007 at 07:27:44 PT

The right thing to do....
"Congress should consider doing away with civil asset forfeiture altogether."
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Comment #3 posted by Hope on July 19, 2007 at 07:25:25 PT

Willie Nelson
He probably does need to rest. Many years ago, I saw a fairly local show with an interview of him.He said that everyone in his family had died relatively young. Forties and fifties, as I remember. He said that most of them smoked tobacco and that he didn't smoke tobacco for that reason . Obviously he and his siblings broke that trend of regular early death.Of course, we all know that cannabis was used commonly as medicine before prohibition. But that program was the first time I'd seen anyone in my time refer to cannabis as medicine. When asked about his cannabis use, he said, "It's good country medicine." As I remember he was being interviewed on his bus.The guy asked him if he had any pot, or something, I forget exactly how he put it. And Willie, feigning excitement, said "No. You got any?", like they might smoke one. It was a good interview. But I remember him saying it was good for you and that it was "Good country medicine". He was right.I do hope and pray he's going to be alright for a very long time. He's a treasure. I'd so hate to lose him. 
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Comment #2 posted by PatrioticDissension on July 19, 2007 at 07:04:58 PT:

sad
This is truly a sad state of affairs. For the best cartoon of John Walters you've ever seen click the link and lemme know if you like it. 
John Walters Comparison
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Comment #1 posted by FoM on July 19, 2007 at 06:55:46 PT

Off Topic: Willie Nelson
I am worried that Willie is sick. We love Willie and those who pray say a little prayer for this wonderful man. He is old and he could retire and that would be ok. I want him to live a long time and be as healthy as he can be.http://www.startribune.com/457/story/1299768.html
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