cannabisnews.com: Protecting The Privacy of Pot










  Protecting The Privacy of Pot

Posted by CN Staff on November 19, 2006 at 07:02:37 PT
By James Kilpatrick  
Source: Southern Illinoisan 

Florida -- Once more into the Fourth Amendment breach, dear friends! In the pending case of Florida v. Rabb, the Supreme Court has a splendid opportunity to affirm the maxim that a man's house is his home - and that he has a right to grow a passel of pot in his attic.Well, not exactly. By taking the case - or better yet, by not taking it - the high court could strike a blow for strict enforcement of a constitutional freedom as old as Magna Carta. These are the facts:
In April 2002, an anonymous informant advised the Broward County sheriff's office that someone was growing marijuana in a residence on Polk Street in Hollywood. The informant, obviously well-informed, identified the urban agronomist as a white male, 35 years of age. Thus prepared, the cops went to the specified address, taking a sniffing dog with them. The dog's name was Chevy. His age does not appear in the record.The posse soon observed a white male exiting the domicile and driving away. The detectives followed in hot pursuit. Ten minutes later they stopped the driver for failing to signal as he changed lanes. The culprit identified himself as "John Brown." He was "visually nervous." His hands trembled. The detectives, skilled at recognizing such indicia of guilt, peered into the vehicle.There they saw two books on cannabis cultivation. This was suspicious. The suspect explained the books by saying, in effect, that botany was his hobby. Suddenly Chevy alerted the cops to the ashtray. A clue! A palpable clue! Cannabis! The suspect broke down. He looked away as the gendarmes extracted two marijuana cigarettes from Brown's left shoe.The party returned to Polk Street. Fifty-five minutes had elapsed. More evidence was required. Once more into the breach! The officers looked again to Chevy, the helpful hound. Handlers led him to the front door. Tally-ho! An alert! This did it. Now armed with a search warrant, police entered the house. They found 64 cannabis plants under cultivation and three cigarettes in a safe. It soon developed that "John Brown" was in fact James Rabb. His arrest followed swiftly. Trial seemed imminent.Rabb's counsel moved to suppress the evidence. A trial court granted his motion, and a divided panel of Florida's 4th District Court of Appeal, speaking through Judge Bobby Gunther, affirmed. Now the case is pending in the U.S. Supreme Court on the state's petition for reversal and remand. We will know before long if Rabb goes free or goes on trial.In her opinion, Judge Gunther relied chiefly on the Supreme Court's opinion five years ago in the case of another residential farmer, Danny Lee Kyllo of Florence, Ore. Using a thermal imaging device, police scanned his house. Telltale images emerged of unusual heat. These led to a search warrant, and behold! A hundred cannabis plants were growing happily inside.Kyllo protested that the thermal imaging violated his constitutional rights. The lower federal courts turned him down: The imaging was not an "unreasonable search" under the Fourth Amendment. He appealed. In an unusual alignment of justices, the Supreme Court reversed, 5-4. Justice Antonin Scalia spoke for a majority that included Justices Souter, Ginsburg, Breyer and Thomas. In dissent, Justice John Paul Stevens spoke for Justices Kennedy, O'Connor and Chief Justice Rehnquist. It was a lineup never seen before and never to be seen again.Now, getting back to the pending case in the high court: As a matter of Fourth Amendment law, is James Rabb's house in Florida to be equated with Danny Kyllo's house in Oregon? As the admissibility of evidence is weighed, is a dog's nose like a thermal imager?Dogs' noses first appeared in Fourth Amendment law in United States v. Raymond Place in 1983, but as Judge Gunther pointed out in Rabb's case, the canine search in Place was a search in Miami's public airport, not in a private home. Rabb had "a legitimate expectation of privacy." If detectives had not summoned Chevy to the door, they likely "would not have detected the odor of marijuana emanating from the house.""Thus the use of the dog, like the use of a thermal imager, allowed law enforcement to intrude into the constitutionally protected area of Rabb's house. ... The use of such a technique by law enforcement constitutes an illegal search."Without evidence from the residence, the Florida cops would be left with a pitiful portion of pot for a federal judge to pass on. Give it up, I'd say. Let us concentrate on crime that truly matters.James Kilpatrick writes for Universal Press Syndicate.Source: Southern Illinoisan (Carbondale, IL)Author: James Kilpatrick Published: Sunday, November 19, 2006Copyright: 2006 Southern IllinoisanContact: letters TheSouthern.comWebsite: http://www.TheSouthern.com/CannabisNews -- Cannabis Archiveshttp://cannabisnews.com/news/list/cannabis.shtml

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Comment #100 posted by Richard Zuckerman on November 25, 2006 at 12:46:53 PT:
READ THE BOOK ABOUT REVENGE
I noticed a few comments made by readers concerning retaliation and revenge. Please read the book entitled "GETTING EVEN...", written around 1999, by a chap from England, describing revenge as a form of justice in certain circumstances?
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Comment #99 posted by Hope on November 25, 2006 at 08:48:08 PT
Greenfox and Mamawillie!
Wonderful to see you posting. Both of you.We had a very good Thanksgiving. Very good. I hope you all did, too. 
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Comment #98 posted by FoM on November 24, 2006 at 06:35:37 PT
greenfox
It's good to see you. It's been a long time since you posted. I hope you had a Happy Thanksgiving Day yesterday.
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Comment #97 posted by greenfox on November 23, 2006 at 13:06:45 PT
a long time growing....
yes Im back. lOok for an update post soon.
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Comment #96 posted by Had Enough on November 21, 2006 at 20:47:27 PT

Great Balls of Fire!!!
I think Jerry Lee Lewis is on Jay Leno tonight.Soon…

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Comment #95 posted by Had Enough on November 21, 2006 at 20:11:33 PT

museman #66
“ I wanted to respond yesterday, but my daughter came home from Norway, so, quality family time and all that....Enjoy that.I know you will.

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Comment #94 posted by whig on November 21, 2006 at 20:04:32 PT

Proof in the pudding
It's an exciting thing to see, and understand. These phrases really do mean something important and specific, it's all about the cannabread in terms of getting the world to heal.The "pudding" is what you set out, the mixture of flour and water, with (in my recipe) some oil, honey and herbs. And some sea salt (uniodized). It's pudding, for sure, which you could eat but it isn't for you. It's a sacrifice.The "proof" is what you get. Yeast of life.
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Comment #93 posted by whig on November 21, 2006 at 20:00:58 PT

museman
If you are looking for a miracle, have you made cannabread yet? It occurs to me that if you cannot find a sourdough (manna from heaven) you could use a commercial yeast to make a starter but it won't be as good.
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Comment #92 posted by whig on November 21, 2006 at 19:44:10 PT

FoM
What I can tell you is that cannabis helps my bone pain a lot.
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Comment #91 posted by FoM on November 21, 2006 at 18:16:57 PT

museman
I am not a Christmas person. It is a time for family. I like my fiber optic tree (trippy you know) and my Christmas Village houses. That's all it is to me. Have a happy and perfectly legal gluttonous Thanksgiving with no guilt to boot! LOL!
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Comment #90 posted by museman on November 21, 2006 at 18:10:19 PT

FoM
Very nice rendering of that occasion. I personally don't celebrate that holi-day for reasons which are probably apparent in light of my posts, but I appreciate the sentiment, and the relationship to family.We celebrate Winter Solstice at my house not by any 'pagan' tradition, but because it seems more real and associated with real earthly and celestial events. We have a 'solstice tree', presents, and so on, but since we believe that Y'shua's birthday was in the spring , and know all about the Roman Catholic holy day compromises, I find the idea of "Christs Mass" kind of offensive.But family traditions, and gathering festivities are all great and good, so I often keep my opinion on that subject to myself. But since I'm in a mood...Anyway. Happy Thanksgiving - I like turkey day, it's honest legal gluttony - to you and yours, and every one else here in virtual cannabisville - the only sane place to be online.peace
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Comment #89 posted by FoM on November 21, 2006 at 18:07:50 PT

museman
I understand what you mean. I guess I look at life in a way that I look for good and value it when I find it. I don't seem to take it all in but only bits and pieces of the big puzzle. It's like a piece of a puzzle. I don't see completed puzzles ever.
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Comment #88 posted by museman on November 21, 2006 at 17:58:51 PT

but..
As I am constantly reminded, I am a pessimist. Specially when it comes to evolution of social systems.The historical indications support the negative far more than the positive. I don't BELIEVE in the negative, I only report it as I see it.Because I know that the miraculous is a potential part of our reality, it is logical to assume that anything can happen, even enough of the human race getting real enough in time to save (or rescue) what needs to be saved. I believe in that possibility, but logicly the facts, the history, and my own experience tells me that without the miraculous actually occurring, there is not much chance of getting out of what's coming.That potential exists, but it is covered in the grime of centuries of ignorance and mis-conception. Though I realize that my humanity limits my delivery - after all I (like others before and along with me) am only a messenger, the very fact that humanity in general rejects the message fortells much to my own logical conclusions.Thus I am pessimistic of the ability of mankind to rise fast enough in general, and over-all to accomplish the kind of wholesale changes in perspective that have to come about before any real effect can be had on the damage, or even stop the progress of the damage, or slow it down enough to gain some precious time.I am skeptical of the 'awakening' as it is being reported in various renditions. The core aspect is real, but though some topics are making it into the mainstream -reluctantly it seems- the conversation has been going on a long, long time.The result is in the pudding.The proof is in the wash.What you see is what you get.Works define the time. "And they'll know we are Christians by our..." What? "Stupid is as stupid does""By their works will you know them."I observe. I tell you what I see.If you see it different well lets add that perspective, not separate or polarize it.One persons observation of their own experiential reality, though apparently in conflict with anothers, does not validate or invalidate that reality, or that experience. 
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Comment #87 posted by FoM on November 21, 2006 at 17:43:42 PT

museman
Yes that is the good news. In every cloud there is a silver lining. Have a Very Happy Thanksgiving.I don't have a Thanksgiving web page but here is my Christmas page. Nothing special just a Christmas page.http://www.freedomtoexhale.com/merry.htm
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Comment #86 posted by museman on November 21, 2006 at 17:24:20 PT

FoM
That's the good news.
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Comment #85 posted by FoM on November 21, 2006 at 17:13:49 PT

museman
The darker the night the easier it becomes to see even a tiny light. People are waking up. People don't want to live like we have been. 
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Comment #84 posted by museman on November 21, 2006 at 17:06:21 PT

FoM 
If everyone lit the candle that they carry in their heart, with the fire of the Sacred, the Sacred would become illuminated. In a world where darkness still holds dominion, such a thing is not so easily done.
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Comment #83 posted by FoM on November 21, 2006 at 16:52:53 PT

museman 
I don't know of anything that will help. When things become too organized they lose something. I don't believe in getting behind organizations or political parties or even a church. I believe that the best things happen spontaneously and from the heart. If everyone lit just one little candle what a bright world this would be.
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Comment #82 posted by global_warming on November 21, 2006 at 16:51:28 PT

Next Time
You catch a glimpse'Of Our 'Humane Society",Your Good HandIn front of your good eyeYou can witness
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Comment #81 posted by museman on November 21, 2006 at 16:40:18 PT

FoM
Our 'Humane Society for people' is the U.S. Justice system. They believe (unlike the 'animal' version) in 'putting us into our misery.'
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Comment #80 posted by global_warming on November 21, 2006 at 16:30:33 PT

re: When you go to a Veteran's hospital
You might wonder who is winningthis warwho is at war?
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Comment #79 posted by museman on November 21, 2006 at 16:30:19 PT

FoM
_ got my post numbers mixed up - sorry -(meant 75-76)I know you know that I meant; "is there a society that IS humane?" A benevolent society is a 'humane society.' Like the mythological 'democracy' so many are always going on about, I don't believe it exists, yet. If some one claims that one does exist, I want to see for myself. No one is going to convince me that there is anything but greed and selfishness at the core of THIS society. If they could that would mean that the core has changed since I last glimpsed it, oh, about so many minutes ago.
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Comment #78 posted by museman on November 21, 2006 at 16:22:31 PT

#76-77
A real good hollywood rendering - graphic imagry that somehow captures that element, see the movie "Jacobs Ladder." The nightmare is well described.
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Comment #77 posted by FoM on November 21, 2006 at 16:21:55 PT

museman 
Unfortunately there is no Humane Society for people.
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Comment #76 posted by FoM on November 21, 2006 at 16:17:35 PT

global_warming
When you go to a Veteran's hospital you will see sights that you wish you wouldn't see. I saw one man who was near death on a stretcher waiting in the hallway for a Cat Scan. He was just parked against the wall for a long time. No one attending him. I wondered why they couldn't have gotten him down and ready for the test with some efficiency. Dignity. It's all about dignity.
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Comment #75 posted by global_warming on November 21, 2006 at 16:11:29 PT

lady fomme
young men with no legs, what weight do carry on your back?you have a very strong back
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Comment #74 posted by museman on November 21, 2006 at 16:10:04 PT

777
"Seven lies, multiplied by seven, multiplied by seven again..." 
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Comment #73 posted by museman on November 21, 2006 at 16:06:33 PT

oops
excuse my dyslexic fingers. I meant "bonafide"
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Comment #72 posted by museman on November 21, 2006 at 16:05:15 PT

FoM
"We would call the Humane Society if we saw someone treating a dog like our Veterans have been treated."Is there a 'Humane' Society? Please point me there so the U.S. Gov can deport me for lack of bonide documentation of my 'citizenship.'
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Comment #71 posted by FoM on November 21, 2006 at 15:56:24 PT

museman
That was excellent. I know my husband has yet to get tested for Agent Orange and that is what he hauled when he was in Vietnam. Fifity five gallon drums of it and it wasn't sealed very well. The impact of war goes on for a life time. One soldier in Iraq said that when you kill someone you also kill a part of yourself. My husband was treated like you said and when I met him I wanted to make him feel cared for no matter what people were saying about the Vietnam Veteran. I have seen the very ill at Wade Park VA Hospital. I have seen the mentally not here anymore soldiers too. I have seen the young men with no legs. I have seen how they are treated. We would call the Humane Society if we saw someone treating a dog like our Veterans have been treated. God help our new war veterans. PS: We watched a special called Vietnam on Discovery last night. It was about soldiers going back and facing their nightmares. It was very good.
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Comment #70 posted by global_warming on November 21, 2006 at 15:54:56 PT

What ?
777 is that the room where all the fresh cannabiscan be smokedso many thanksyou wouldn't trick me ?
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Comment #69 posted by Had Enough on November 21, 2006 at 15:49:50 PT

Next 40 yrs…
Cell Block 777….

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Comment #68 posted by global_warming on November 21, 2006 at 15:45:18 PT

re: next 40 years.
do you have phonecell block 7 ?calling, calling, callingIs there any human beings out there?
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Comment #67 posted by museman on November 21, 2006 at 15:34:15 PT

topic
The constitutional issue of privacy may very well be the legal lever that unseats the 1,000 pound gorilla.
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Comment #66 posted by museman on November 21, 2006 at 15:32:30 PT

FoM
I wanted to respond yesterday, but my daughter came home from Norway, so, quality family time and all that...."...Vietnam was the issue. I knew that all young men could be drafted and they had to do what the government said to do or be called every name under the book."This called to mind a situation that very few want to talk about - the treatment of veterans.As a child of 5 I remember seeing homeless, disabled (ww1 and 2) vets on the streets of Kansas City, selling pencils for a living. I thought then that something 'wasn't quite right'....After Vietnam, we came back to a country that was divided. There were no parades, no welcome home banners, no "we support our troops" stickers for Yuppie mobiles. On the one hand, our own peers were throwing cans, bottles, and inuendos at us; "baby killers!" "bloody war mongers!" while the other half was embarassed about losing Vietnam and ignored us.There were no "debriefings" of returning soldiers, no efforts to ease the transition from 'baby killer' to joe citizen. The damage done to so many by Agent Orange -for one example- has never been addressed sufficiently, I know several brothers who died of it, while the V.A. and it's government funders were spending untold billions trying to deny any responsibility or culpability in the whole debacle. There is a sad tale of a local man, who lived on the fringe his whole life -incidentally his story is the one that the movie " "Good morning Vietnam!" in which Robin Williams played his character, is all about.That man battled with the V.A. his entire life, and 2 weeks before he died the V.A. finally kicked down and awarded him compensation. For two whole weeks of his entire life since Vietnam ruined it, he was a happy man. I saw pictures he had of the devastated terrain, the dead trees, dead landscape - all the effects of agent orange, and it took the government that sent him there over 30 years to even acknowledge that anything had even happened to him.There are Vietnam vets wandering the in between space of a nightmare land of a war they still fight in their dreams, and in their 'waking life'. Many thousands of maimed, and permanently disabled veterans - like in any other war - are given poverty-level compensation -if they were so badly damaged it was so obvious that it couldn't be denied -(agent orange rotted the inside, where it couldn't be 'seen') but they are relegated to a life of literal shortcoming. There are thousands and thousands more who are mortally wounded inside, physically, psychologically, and spiritually, whose leaders deny any claims of responsibility. The Vietnam veterans, the ones that healed some of their horror, have been instrumental in a lot of social changes -including stopping that war, but there are a multitude left literally to die without aid or succor in the land of their birth, which they honorably went to defend. The ignorance of the State is criminal negligence.One of the other down sides are the veterans who become efficient stalkers, killers, and destroyers. These are recruited into civiilian 'law enforcement', and CIA covert military. Predators who enjoyed their work. Society has rewarded these veterans, and even given some of them medals. But the over all rank-and-file service person re-enters society from such experience left with whatever devices they have left to fend for themselves. They are paid a pittance in the first place, if there were any justice, they would be recieving the six figure wages that their leaders get -for whatever it is that they actually do- , and their 'leaders' would be getting much, much less. At least in this current system of values that would be true economic 'payment for services rendered.'Does anyone think that these veterans, whose generation is facing a lot of stuff, are going to be treated any better than the Vietnam vets, or the ww1 and 2 vets?The death and destruction of the now in Iraq will continue to haunt this generation for the next 40 years.Just my opinion.
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Comment #65 posted by global_warming on November 21, 2006 at 15:14:45 PT

this place is far
from the Sabbath Dayhow so many human beings go on?save something whiteto bring to the table
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Comment #64 posted by global_warming on November 21, 2006 at 15:01:36 PT

re: protecting the privacy of pot
pot is like an innocent childwho picks up some newspaper and learns to readsome small informationit can be be about aunt Beait can be about me and youtake a moment to reflectwho you arewho you behow you are votingfor what is importantTo the bone from the heartCan you hold the flag of freedomHigher and Higher
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Comment #63 posted by FoM on November 21, 2006 at 13:06:59 PT

Whig
Paget's is a bone disorder. The children's father died of Muscular Dystrophy and he had Paget's Disease too. They tested the 8 children because both are hereditary and a few have Paget's and MD and one has Pagets but so far no Muscular Dystrophy. They have been in their late 30s when they were diagnosed. 
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Comment #62 posted by whig on November 21, 2006 at 12:59:04 PT

Paget's
Bone disorder?
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Comment #61 posted by whig on November 21, 2006 at 12:52:20 PT

FoM
I'll try to do some research on Paget's disease later, I have to go to the doctor's office this afternoon for my infusion.I recently met a man with a skin condition (which is more complex than that, and has internal complications as well) called Ehlers-Danlos. I think cannabis anointing oil applied to the skin should help him, and a loaf of good cannabis eucharist bread never hurts.However you may feel about these things, if it helps sick people become well, who cares what we call them?
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Comment #60 posted by FoM on November 21, 2006 at 12:34:57 PT

Whig
I wanted to correct the word from mental to brain. They believe some of her children which are adults might have a genetic brain disease. It has to do with the Paget's Disease or MD they have since it is genetic or at least the MD is and I think Paget's Disease is too.
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Comment #59 posted by FoM on November 21, 2006 at 12:20:22 PT

Whig
Very good choice. I am researching something that is really intense for me right now. I also found out that they want my sister's family to go to a hospital in Kentucky to be tested for a very serious mental condition for lack of a better way of putting it. It seems from my research that marijuana would help if they test positive. They will be paying all expenses for the family to have this special test. It's an MRI.
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Comment #58 posted by whig on November 21, 2006 at 12:11:04 PT

Video duration is even 4:20
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OO5LkJJlpTU
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Comment #57 posted by whig on November 21, 2006 at 12:09:39 PT

FoM
Good song selection. Playing now. John Lennon is great.
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Comment #56 posted by FoM on November 21, 2006 at 12:01:42 PT

Whig
I don't play mind games. Think what you want. It's fine with me. 
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Comment #55 posted by whig on November 21, 2006 at 11:37:01 PT

FoM
We're mirrors, though. If you see anger it is within yourself.
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Comment #54 posted by FoM on November 21, 2006 at 11:21:41 PT

Whig
Thank you. You seem angry and come across that way to some of us. The election is over and it will take a long time to change the direction of our country under this new leadership so I think everyone should let the elections alone and get on with it as best as we can. I know you are smart but the tone of comments can be seen in writings too. I know I put an adjective in front of a word and I got called out on it and I realized I shouldn't have done it. I should keep my feelings to myself because my way isn't everyones way. 
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Comment #53 posted by whig on November 21, 2006 at 11:14:08 PT

FoM
I'm sorry, I'm just frustrated and not at you in particular. Dankhank accused me of threatening someone (I never did.) Toker00 seemed to think I was making negative inferences about him when I was just saying I was a Generation X'er. And you seemed to think I am in favor of retaliatory violence, which I am not. All while you've asked me not to talk about my writings elsewhere and suggested that you want me to talk less about what I think. So it makes me feel unwelcome.I'm sorry to hear about your family member, and I know that holidays can be stressful times for everyone, so this is just a phase we're having right now I think. I also think that since the elections just ended a lot of pent up emotion is coming out now. I hope it will get better soon.
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Comment #52 posted by FoM on November 21, 2006 at 11:07:41 PT

Whig
I think what I should do if it upsets you is I won't respond. I was just trying to find out what you meant that's all. I don't have anything more to say on this. I'm trying to get ready for the holidays and I just found out today another one of my family members was diagnosed with Muscular Dystrophy. I wish you a Happy Thanksgiving and Mrs. Whig too.
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Comment #51 posted by whig on November 21, 2006 at 11:05:49 PT

FoM
The truth is, I could say a lot more and make myself a lot more clear, but I feel it would be unwelcome. So I have a catch-22. I cannot speak my mind but you jump to wrong conclusions about what I mean.
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Comment #50 posted by whig on November 21, 2006 at 11:02:47 PT

FoM
Well it isn't what I said. You are reading things that aren't there, and it makes me upset.
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Comment #49 posted by FoM on November 21, 2006 at 10:44:13 PT

whig
What you said meant to me that you want Peace but if you mess with my family I will retaliate. That's what it said to me. 
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Comment #48 posted by whig on November 21, 2006 at 10:36:31 PT

FoM
I mean what I say, and the more I try to clarify the more some people will be confused and more will need to be said, then leading to me becoming more misunderstood, which is why I've been shy to post here lately.If you don't know that I'm against war, what do you think I mean?
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Comment #47 posted by FoM on November 21, 2006 at 10:19:11 PT

Whig
What did you mean then?
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Comment #46 posted by whig on November 21, 2006 at 10:16:34 PT

FoM
I am against retaliation too.
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Comment #45 posted by FoM on November 21, 2006 at 09:39:39 PT

Whig
I'm not sure what you mean by Do not war against my family and I will not war against your family.Peace can only be achieved when we don't retaliate even when we are wronged. 
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Comment #44 posted by whig on November 21, 2006 at 09:27:42 PT

And now I must say my peace
Do not war against my family and I will not war against your family. But neither will we gang up together and war against some other family any more. No more war.
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Comment #43 posted by whig on November 21, 2006 at 09:25:50 PT

The stakes
This is a war over slavery, it has always been a war over slavery.
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Comment #42 posted by Had Enough on November 21, 2006 at 05:40:55 PT

Peace
Can we ever have it?There are too many, that just won’t let it happen.
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Comment #41 posted by Had Enough on November 21, 2006 at 05:21:28 PT

Civil War Draft - Check the Date 
JULY 13, 1863 - JULY 16, 1863 
New York City Draft Riots A mob of mostly poor Irish immigrants riots in New York City, angered at Civil War draft laws perceived to protect the privileged and wealthy. The rioters are particularly incensed by a provision in the draft laws exempting those who can pay $300 or supply a substitute. Over 1,000 people die as the mob attacks African Americans, draft officials, and Republican leaders. Draft RiotsDraft Riots, mob violence incited in New York City from July 13 to July 16, 1863, during the American Civil War, by opponents of conscription and individuals sympathetic to the Confederate cause. Because of the traditional hostility of the American people to compulsory military service, the federal government had relied, during the early stages of the war, on voluntary enlistment to obtain recruits for the Union armies. The pressing need for more soldiers compelled Congress to pass (March 3, 1863) legislation, known as the Enrollment Act, that imposed liability for military duty on virtually all ablebodied males between the ages of 20 and 45. Opponents of the administration and policies of President Abraham Lincoln vigorously attacked the bill, criticizing with particular emphasis a provision that enabled draftees to obtain exemption from service by supplying a substitute or by the payment of $300. As the date for enforcement of the act approached, dissatisfaction with this provision, called the “Rich Man's Exemption,” became widespread among the poor of New York City, especially Irish immigrants. Although no disturbances occurred on Saturday, July 11, when the draft came into effect, its resumption on the following Monday was marked by the rapid gathering of an unruly crowd, which soon attacked and burned the draft headquarters. The crowd kept fire apparatus from the building, and flames shortly spread to the entire block. Attempts by the New York City police and a small detachment of U.S. Marines to disperse the rioters provoked the mob to intensified violence. The rioters, joined by additional thousands of sympathizers, roamed freely through the city, destroying property and committing other outrages. These were directed especially against blacks, whom the mob considered responsible for the Civil War. Many were lynched, and on Monday afternoon the rioters sacked and burned the Colored Orphan Asylum, a charitable institution housing nearly 800 black children. The rioting subsided late Monday night but was resumed with even greater violence on Tuesday, July 14. Police, aided by small detachments of troops stationed in and near the city, made vain attempts to disperse the mobs. More blacks were murdered, black neighborhoods were burned, and general pillaging took place. Unrestrained rioting continued until July 15, when military detachments reached the city from Pennsylvania and from West Point, New York. Temporary suspension of the draft was announced the same day. By Thursday, July 16, law and order had been restored. Estimated fatalities during the three days of violence totaled more than 1000. More than 50 large buildings were destroyed by fire, and property damage was about $2 million.****"Draft Riots."Microsoft® Encarta® Encyclopedia 2001. © 1993-2000 Microsoft Corporation. All rights reserved. 
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Comment #40 posted by Richard Zuckerman on November 20, 2006 at 16:54:06 PT:

ASSERT THE STATE CONSTITUTION!!!
Florida v. Rabb is a FEDERAL case! Sometimes, your STATE CONSTITUTION may be more protective than the FEDERAL constitution!!! The U.S. Supreme Court opinion in the summary reveral and remand some six months ago, based on Illinois v. Caballes, is seriously flawed! The United States Supreme Court continues their ABSURD legal position that a dog sniff is not a "SEARCH" for federal constitutional Fourth Amendment purposes!!! The Illinois v. Caballes case was a motor vehicle stop for a written warning of a motor vehicle code violation, accompanied by a police dog sniff resulting in a hit for drugs in the motor vehicle trunk. UNDER THE STATE CONSTITUTION, the State Courts should respectfully disagree with allowing police dogs to appear at motor vehicle stops to engage in unwarranted fishing expeditions! It is because your families vote for Democrats and Republicans, or don't vote at all, which invites the appointment of these U.S. Supreme Court police-state Justices whom continue this "drug war" against the people, endorsing the drug laws and lying to the jury to restrict jury nullification!! As for myself, I vote Libertarian Party, Green Party, and write-in candidates, as a registered spoiler who has learned from over 25 years of voting that Democrats/Republicans are liars for the sake of their corporatism. If the Council on Foreign Relations has their way, the international borders will evaporate by the year 2010, the federal constitution will be repealed, our state constitutions will be repealed, and we will fall under United Nations law. Get ready for the worst! Even if Nancy Pelosi is in favor of medical "Marijuana", even if the Democrats have obtained more power since this most recent election, it will not make much difference. Look who finances the election campaigns of BOTH republicans and democrats? As you people continue to endorse public schools, major media, Democratic and Republican party candidates, the invasion of "undocumented workers" [Has any of you readers ever heard of the "Plan of San Diego", devised by Mexicans in 1915, to KILL EVERY WHITE MALE OVER THE AGE OF 16?????], "free trade agreements," this country will continue to spiral downwards.  Richard Paul Zuckerman, Post Office Box 159, Metuchen, New Jersey, 08840-0159, (Cell telephone number)(848) 250-8879.
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Comment #39 posted by global_warming on November 20, 2006 at 16:24:04 PT

high in the wilderness
 [Please refrain from using profanity in your message]my message is filled with profanityand a 'thank you'
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Comment #38 posted by global_warming on November 20, 2006 at 15:51:52 PT

sorry 36
'The war is against earth and nature and God.'The war is in our hearts,..
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Comment #37 posted by global_warming on November 20, 2006 at 15:47:26 PT

re: The only thing left that is still available 
"is oxygen, and they're fast closing in on that as well."I love you when you get angry,and every man and women looked upand looked whith-in and caught a glimpseAre we already at Armageddon?Is it my turn in this draft yet?I use my turn to voteNot sure who invented votingTomorrow I might see every Democrat and Republican Fall to their knee, and Rasti's wash their hair,Talk about "memory" and "loss"That moment when you saw your placeFrom that 'moment' you have breathed your first place,Became a witness, who looked 'up'It is time to unite 
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Comment #36 posted by whig on November 20, 2006 at 15:45:28 PT

museman
The war is against earth and nature and God.
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Comment #35 posted by FoM on November 20, 2006 at 13:50:54 PT

museman
I know what you mean. I didn't have any brothers so I didn't know anything about war until I got older and Vietnam was the issue. I knew that all young men could be drafted and they had to do what the government said to do or be called every name under the book. 
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Comment #34 posted by museman on November 20, 2006 at 13:33:00 PT

FoM
For time immemorial, 'war' has been the prime experience of men from the time of their childhood to their teenage 'rite of passage', and on into adulthood.When we were kids in the 50's and 60's (at least the males), the game of war was the number one choice for American boys. "cowboys and indians" was a close second.I had thousands of toy soldiers ('army men'),and their accessories. For many years I and my fellows spent many hours replaying 'famous battles', and of course our own variations. When I went into the service, and came home for leave in the middle of boot camp, I and my friends 17-18 year olds actually 'played army'. Within a year that 'innocence' was forever lost.My point is that society, and all it's accompanying institutionalism deliberately programs the lower classes from birth for war. If it doesn't manifest the way the rulers want it, we end up with things like gangs, and 'street wars', because war is part of our programmed nature.In my observation of history, not a single generation (in recorded history - since the establishment of kingdoms, and principalities -) has lived an entire lifetime without war. Not one.It is only recently that people of any numbers have voiced such a desire to end the perpetual war mentality. With a system in place that is so geared for war, it is no coincidence that almost every agressive action of our government is labeled a 'war on' something. The problem is interwoven in our sense of values, our education system, religions, and in fact has been created as another 'reality' un-natural, unpleasant, inhuman, and totally controlled by the standards themselves -which are about power and wealth.The natural world that we were given by God, that we inherit just by virtue of our being born, has been stolen from us, and instead we get war, eco-destruction, poverty and it's associated load of problems, and all our natural choices are now directly tied to the market. Once in my own lifetime, the water was safe to drink almost everywhere. They've managed to get most of the control over that, by polluting our resources, so that one has to pay for the natural right of drinking water. The only thing left that is still available is oxygen, and they're fast closing in on that as well.Until folks are willing to get to the heart of the matter, which is our collective values, then war, and destruction will continue all the way to Armageddon.
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Comment #33 posted by FoM on November 20, 2006 at 12:51:36 PT

museman
I don't believe in war. If like what happened in the movie Red Dawn happened here I would pick up a gun and turn in to Annie Oakley. Other then invading our country war isn't an issue with me. My Father said that invasion of our country should be the only reason for war and I to this day agree with what he taught me. He and my grandfather were WW I Veterans. My father was born in 1900. My Grandfather was a Colonel or something important but he died before I ever met him so I don't know the details very well.
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Comment #32 posted by FoM on November 20, 2006 at 12:45:10 PT

Key Democrats Oppose Renewing Military Draft
 November 20, 2006 
 WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Leading Democrats who soon will control the legislative agenda in the Congress rejected on Monday a colleague's call for reinstatement of the U.S. military draft."I don't favor it," said Sen. Carl Levin of Michigan, who is set to chair the Senate Armed Services Committee when Democrats take over both houses of Congress from Republicans in January."I don't think we need it," added Levin, whose panel oversees military programs. He spoke to reporters after meeting with Robert Gates, President George W. Bush's choice to replace retiring Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld. The top two Democrats in the U.S. House of Representatives also voiced their opposition to a plan being pushed by Rep. Charles Rangel, a New York Democrat, for drafting soldiers into the army for the first time since 1973. The idea is not supported by Republicans either."We did not include that" in legislative plans for early next year, said Democratic Rep. Steny Hoyer of Maryland, who will be House majority leader when the new Congress convenes in January.URL: http://tinyurl.com/thd3a
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Comment #31 posted by museman on November 20, 2006 at 12:19:28 PT

draft
During Vietnam, there were very few deferments for the average middle-class or lower citizen. The ony ones that worked were 'college', and strict adherence to certain religious standards- acceptable by the status quo of course. The draft was such a numbers generated machine, a juggernaut that wouldn't stop until we literally laid down infront of it, many deferments - like a medical for instance, didn't make it through the system until after the soldier was already dead. I was deemed 4-f by my draft board, but I didn't get the news until I was actually in boot camp, too late then. Some folks tried real hard to establish the 'conscientious objector' status, but even though legally it was accepted, they had so many psychological loopholes - the catch-22's- no one was able to make it stick.Civil Service? For what? A country that is systematically destroying all life on planet earth? If not us directly, it is our standards of viewing reality, and the contaminated 'American Dream' that we foist on the rest of the world whether they like it or not.Civil service like; every cop, judge, lawyer, and politician should get the full mpact of their 'sentencing guidelines' and the 'penal system' in action - they should all do at least one month in a state penitentiary before thay can assume office. All 'Civil servants' who make more than a 'living wage' should have a mandatory limitation on all children who enter military service - no guaranteed commissions based on economic criteria. In other words children of politicians should have to experience the same rigors of an enlisted person - same chances for death and maiming as an inner city poor black man -for example.I have made my positiion on a new draft quite clear; I am not into war, but if I have to fight in one, it will be on my front door-step defending my personal, and family safety and freedom. As far as I am concerned, a military draft is anti-freedom, anti democratic, and a tactic of a fascist regime whose justified unpopularity needs to coerce it's citizens to serve it. The draft is unconstitutional as it is the same thing as 'military conscription' that was an issue in the Revolutionary War, and was included in the dos and don'ts of governmental powers. Being railroaded into fighting the battles of the wealthy is not right, any way you cut it.Why should the effort and the responsibility fall mostly on the shoulders of the young generation that would be prime choice for cannon fodder? Does getting beyond draft age mean that it's no longer our concern? I have sweated through the teenage years of 6 children wondering if I would have to shoot some soldiers when they came to take my sons or daughters off to some 'conflict', 'police action' or war.War is made for conquest and aquisition. Never, never, never, has it been about anything else regardless of the Hitlers, religious fervors, and various 'national' issues that 'justify' such actions. It's about somebody getting rich and powerful, and ABSOLUTELY NOTHING ELSE!!!!!!!!!!!So how can people who claim 'enlightenment' step down off their pedestal of purity and embrace such things as 'Civil Service', and justify a draft, or war. Iraq was a mistake, militarily, strategicly, economicly, morally, and ethically. How can we reason - like an accountant with a calculator- something like 'honorable withdrawal' and the 'acceptable costs' of human life it would take to get out without sullying our 'national honor'? F our national honor, we have no honor, our leaders have demonstrated this to the world, but we as a people collectively are slow to admit the fact that we are citizens of a country that has committed acts as heinous against man, god, and the earth, as any historical villain. So in order to 'save face' we are willing to reap more and more destruction?America wake up.
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Comment #30 posted by FoM on November 20, 2006 at 10:54:40 PT

Pentagon Study Narrows Down Iraq Options
Secret Pentagon Study Narrows Down Options for Iraq to 'Go Big, Go Long, Go Home'WASHINGTON -- Nov 20, 2006 (AP)— A Pentagon review of Iraq has come up with three options injecting more troops into Iraq, shrinking the force but staying longer or pulling out, The Washington Post reported Monday. The newspaper quoted senior defense officials as dubbing the three alternatives "Go big, go long and go home." http://www.abcnews.go.com/Politics/wireStory?id=2667790
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Comment #29 posted by FoM on November 20, 2006 at 10:42:11 PT

Dankhank
The class separation during the Vietnam war was really a hard thing for people to handle. It went something like this. The college students are the future of our country and the poor folks need future leaders if they don't die in the war. That was the mentality.
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Comment #28 posted by Dankhank on November 20, 2006 at 10:10:13 PT

Robert Heinlein ...
made a case for universal service and it's tie to EARNING citizenship.Contained in the first chapter or two of his novel "Starship Troopers," a short missive about Why it weas needed.Surviving veterans of the last war started over and said, "Never again will political leaders serve without spending two years in gov't service."Bushies Nat'l guard service doesn't count, you have to show up.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Starship_Troopers
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Comment #27 posted by FoM on November 20, 2006 at 10:05:42 PT

Roger and Out Good Buddy
This song by Neil Young is about a Vietnam soldier getting killed and is one of the most touching songs on LWW. I don't hate because it isn't the way I think or feel but I do hate war.http://www.neilyoung.com/lwwtoday/lwwvideos/rogerandout_wm.html
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Comment #26 posted by dongenero on November 20, 2006 at 09:43:04 PT

comment #25
I believe that is the point and dialogue Sen. Rangel is trying to make by raising the idea of enacting a draft.
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Comment #25 posted by Toker00 on November 20, 2006 at 09:25:01 PT

Break it out, Max,
let's have a look.Maybe Front Line military service should be required of ALL politician's CHILDREN during wartime. If they keep Peace around the world, they keep THEIR children at home, and OUR children, safe. They might think a little harder about what the Elite tell them to do.Toke. 
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Comment #24 posted by FoM on November 20, 2006 at 09:16:01 PT

Max Flowers
Back during the Vietnam war my brother in law converted to being a Mennonite and got out of going into the armed services by being a conscientious objector. I think that the college deferments were the most upsetting back then. No religious reason just hiding behind a college. Most poor young men and women don't get to college and that just wasn't fair.
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Comment #23 posted by Toker00 on November 20, 2006 at 09:11:34 PT

Everybody look at what's goin'down...
Predicting a slowing economy. Predicting a draft. If it were a war on us as a people, there would be no reason for a draft. But it's not. It's a war of Lies for Profit, and the people are waking to that reality, and are stopping their support and refusing to fight. Not now that we KNOW 9-11 was an inside job. Not now that we KNOW The Bush Crime Family goes way back in our History as supporting Nazism and Fascism. Not now that we KNOW our government tortures people. No WMDs. No Nuclear Capability. It's just about the Oil. That's all it's about. That and the Profit made by going after that Oil. And the control of others that owning that oil potentially brings. The New World Order. Break it in front of their FACES! Refuse to participate and expose their evil! NO NEW WORLD ORDER, EVER!!!Toke.  
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Comment #22 posted by Max Flowers on November 20, 2006 at 08:59:05 PT

Drafted and shafted
Rangel is also the guy, I believe, who proposed a draft for everyone 18 to 42. 42!! Can you imagine the gutting of the American workplace and home that would take place if everyone up to 42 had to report for duty? It would be so disastrous to the domestic (civilian) economy that it isn't even cool to think about! That is such a huge section of the country's populace. That idea is just nuts.I created an "infoproduct" about a year ago designed at assisting parents and their kids who want to register their kids as conscientious objectors so as to avoid a draft, and then I put it away after I decided that a draft was not imminent after all. Now, it looks like I'll be dusting it off again and modifying it to be targeted to not just parents, but any adult as well who wants to avoid the draft on that basis.Even though I don't believe such an idea would survive a day of serious discussions on Capitol Hill, I'm sure glad I'm over 42.
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Comment #21 posted by FoM on November 20, 2006 at 08:54:02 PT

dongenero
I agree with you. My problem is thinking of how it was during Vietnam. I don't believe in war and that's my problem with the whole war issue. If every young person will need to do time for the government how will they keep the rich kids from joining the Peace Corp while sending the poor kids into combat? Will the poor young people be able to do state side service too?
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Comment #20 posted by dongenero on November 20, 2006 at 08:37:01 PT

draft
There is nothing like a draft to cure people of waging unnecessary wars.
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Comment #19 posted by FoM on November 20, 2006 at 07:17:24 PT

Off Topic: DUI Testing
To Crack Down on DUIs, More Alcohol Sensors Urged in CarsMonday, November 20, 2006WASHINGTON -- The threat of arrest and punishment, for decades the primary tactic against drunken drivers, is no longer working in the struggle to reduce the death toll, authorities say. Instead, they are proposing to tackle the problem by turning to technology: alcohol detection devices in every vehicle.In the first phase of the plan, Mothers Against Drunk Driving, backed by a national association of state highway officials and car manufacturers, will announce here today a campaign to change drunken-driving laws in 49 states to require that even first offenders be made to install a device that tests drivers and shuts down the car if it detects alcohol.http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/national/292991_madd20.html

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Comment #18 posted by FoM on November 20, 2006 at 06:26:04 PT

Hi Everyone
I worry that Rove will spins a Draft around to get rich people and young adults to vote for them in 08 if the Draft is brought back. The Draft was a terrible thing to hang over young people's heads so I can't be happy about it's prospects. If there was no way out for the rich and the poor it would make college kids who have more money realize that they aren't special and it would take the load off the poor that go into the armed services because they need a job. I watched the special on Iran last night. I hope we don't even think about going into Iran but Bush wants their oil too I believe. Does Iran have a lot of oil? Barry McCaffrey said oil is what we want over there. I guess paying for oil is not what they want to do. It seems like taking it is how we do it.
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Comment #17 posted by Had Enough on November 20, 2006 at 05:42:09 PT

(Aaahh) Get ready, cause here I come (on my way)
re: 14This certainly will catch the attention of our American younger Sons & Daughters.I’ve heard the phrase, “What do I care?”. They will care after the draft. And I will bet Dollars against Donuts that it will be run the way it was in the 60’s.********yeah, c’mon on all you big strong menUncle Sam needs your help againhe’s got himself in a terrible jamway down yonder in Vietnamso put down your books and pick up a gunwe’re gonna have a whole lot of funhttp://www.lyricsdownload.com/country-joe-and-the-fish-fish-cheer-lyrics.html

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Comment #16 posted by mayan on November 20, 2006 at 05:17:08 PT

First Of All
The mainstream media must acknowledge that we have at least
14 PERMANENT military bases in Iraq. We are NEVER leaving there unless we abandon those PERMANENT bases. Second of all...What country lies between Afghanistan and Iraq? Iran.The Next Act - Is a damaged Administration less likely to attack Iran, or more?
http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article15679.htm 

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Comment #15 posted by Had Enough on November 20, 2006 at 04:42:35 PT

Charlie has been at it for a while now
Rangel introduces bill to reinstate draft	Wednesday, January 8, 2003 Posted: 4:28 AM EST (0928 GMT)WASHINGTON (CNN) -- Rep. Charles Rangel introduced a bill in Congress Tuesday to reinstate the military draft, saying fighting forces should more closely reflect the economic makeup of the nation. The New York Democrat told reporters his goal is two-fold: to jolt Americans into realizing the import of a possible unilateral strike against Iraq, which he opposes, and "to make it clear that if there were a war, there would be more equitable representation of people making sacrifices." 
"I truly believe that those who make the decision and those who support the United States going into war would feel more readily the pain that's involved, the sacrifice that's involved, if they thought that the fighting force would include the affluent and those who historically have avoided this great responsibility," Rangel said.more...http://www.cnn.com/2003/ALLPOLITICS/01/07/rangel.draft/*****************************FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE:February 14, 2006		Contact: George Dalley (202) 225-4365		RANGEL REINTRODUCES DRAFT BILL	
	WASHINGTON - Lawmaker Says Volunteer Military May be Overwhelmed by Military Challenges in Iran, North Korea and Syria requiring more troops who will have to be draftedCongressman Charles Rangel today introduced new legislation to reinstate the military draft that will include draftees up to 42 years of age. "Every day that the military option is on the table, as declared by the President in his State of the Union address, in Iran, North Korea, and Syria, reinstatement of the military draft is an option that must also be considered, whether we like it or not," Congressman Rangel said. "If the military is already having trouble getting the recruits they need, what can we do to fill the ranks if the war spreads from Iraq to other countries? We may have no other choice but a draft."The bill would mandate military service for men and women between the ages of 18 and 42. Deferments would be allowed only for completion of high school up to the age of 20, and for reasons of health, conscience or religious belief. Recruits not needed by the military in any given year would be required to perform some national civilian service.more...http://www.house.gov/list/press/ny15_rangel/CBRStatementonDraft02142006.html

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Comment #14 posted by Toker00 on November 20, 2006 at 03:40:41 PT

Here's an interesting take on the Draft.
This came in an e-mail, but was posted at another site.jack topel  wrote at FORUM_FOR_DISCLOSUR ES:
> Yes Lori, but WHY will Rep. Rangel seek to reinstate the Draft
>  
>  To Lori and others whom have passed this news items throughout the Internet,
>  
>  The heading on this post surely caught my attention and was curious enough to click on it to find out what the hell!!!
>  
>  Now that I read Rangel's reasoning, which I underlined and highlighted below, it makes sense and I AGREE!...I'll tell you why.
>  
>  First, I agree with the 2 reasons Rangel brought up (see underlined highlights). Most importantly, I see it as a means to get our college students back to civic activism which were one of the primary forces that brought an end to the Vietnam War with their countless massive demonstrations and civic unrest.
>  
>  Based on this Administration, I can't think of too many things that would get them to accept a more expedient end to the Iraq chaos than if college students have a draft staring them in their faces!
>  
>  It is high time that the majority of our young adults get off their asses and pay attention to what is at stake FOR THEM, not only with Iraq, but also with our Representative Democracy and our economic/employment future and become political/civic activists IN MASS!!!
>  
>  JackI'm not saying I agree, but it IS and interesting way of looking at it. And TRUE!Toke.
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Comment #13 posted by Toker00 on November 20, 2006 at 03:11:41 PT

FoM #10
It probably won't be long now.http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20061120/ap_on_go_co/military_draft_10And we just elected these pricks for change, as in ending the war in Iraq and bringing our soldiers home. The change from War to Peace. The change from Tyranny back to some semblance of a Constitutional Republic. Looks like we've still got a lot of work to do.Toke.
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Comment #12 posted by mayan on November 20, 2006 at 03:01:55 PT

Exit Strategy For Iraq
Iran
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Comment #11 posted by FoM on November 19, 2006 at 17:25:14 PT

Off Topic:   9 PM Discovery Channel
DSC — Koppel: Iran - The Most Dangerous NationFor twenty-seven years America and Iran have nursed suspicions and hurts, and now the nuclear issue has brought all that to the boiling point. Koppel on Discovery goes inside Iran to examine the roots of this mistrust.
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Comment #10 posted by FoM on November 19, 2006 at 17:19:44 PT

The Draft
I was wondering how much longer it would be until the Draft would have to return. Rangel might introduce a Draft Bill or something like that. I guess the troops really need help. They can't keep going back for more tours in Iraq. Maybe it will wake up some people that haven't been worried about a mandatory service for the country. Maybe young people will get involved more in the anti-war movement then. It's only a matter of time if we can't get out of Iraq soon. Our men and women in the armed services can't take much more. War what is it good for? Absolutely nothing.
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Comment #9 posted by whig on November 19, 2006 at 15:50:58 PT

TroutMask
Convenient allergy.
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Comment #8 posted by TroutMask on November 19, 2006 at 13:57:19 PT

Here's one...
Here's the only thing I found with a quick search:http://www.leadvilleherald.com/archives/041306.pdfI think I heard it on the local (Denver) news. I thought they said something like 6 grows had been detected by this person.-TM
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Comment #7 posted by whig on November 19, 2006 at 12:48:23 PT

TroutMask
Do you have a link?
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Comment #6 posted by FoM on November 19, 2006 at 12:12:04 PT

OT: California Reconsiders Snitching
Sunday, November 19, 2006  California's criminal-justice system often convicts innocent people. In recognition of this fact, the state Senate created the California Commission on the Fair Administration of Justice. That commission is now considering the government's use of criminal informants or "snitches," a public policy that has become a disturbing contributor to the wrongful conviction problem. URL: http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/chronicle/archive/2006/11/19/EDGRMLJIMG1.DTL
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Comment #5 posted by TroutMask on November 19, 2006 at 10:46:17 PT

A similar issue...
If they can't use a dog to search from outside, how will this affect the law enforcement officer in Leadville, Colorado, who has a severe allergic reaction when in the vicinity of live marijuana? They have apparently busted several grows in Leadville just due to this officer becoming extremely ill near a house, with no other evidence that there is a grow operation there.
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Comment #4 posted by ekim on November 19, 2006 at 10:13:50 PT

a site worth looking at
just read about it at www.drugwarrant.com
http://www.thecostofwar.com
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Comment #3 posted by afterburner on November 19, 2006 at 09:47:52 PT

OT: [Reflections on The Election] Reluctantly... 
We voted for change, and for many that meant voting for Democrats, warts, foibles and all. A wave of anger spread across the land. We voted out many incumbents because we are tired of lies. We want a new direction. Democrats, don't forget who elected you. We have high expectations. We are watching you. We will hold your feet to the fire [colorful metaphor, not condoning torture]. If you betray us, we will vote *you* out. No more politics as usual.
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Comment #2 posted by goneposthole on November 19, 2006 at 09:11:49 PT

Give us this day our daily reef...
forgive those who trespass against us.

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Comment #1 posted by FoM on November 19, 2006 at 08:24:29 PT

Just a Comment
I hope everyone is having a great weekend. This is the slump after elections that we have every year. To me it's a time of reflection. It's a time to think what went wrong and what went right. I really hope that the organizations look and change directions to make us move forward rather then backwards. We have a chance now if we don't let the people like Rove run all over the newly elected Democrats. Hate shouldn't drive us and hopefully it won't. Have a nice day everyone.
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