cannabisnews.com: S.C. Should Not Stand For 'Stoner City'










††S.C. Should Not Stand For 'Stoner City'

Posted by CN Staff on March 26, 2006 at 08:22:07 PT
By Karol Delmar†
Source: Santa Cruz Sentinel†

Santa Cruz -- Some time ago, a medical marijuana clinic was opened in Santa Cruz with the stated intention of giving compassionate help to people with debilitating medical conditions who have symptoms that were not relieved by any other medication. And there are such people. As time went on, the amount of marijuana that a person could get at any one time was increased. As for oversight ó is there any at all?
How are these people running the dispensary accountable? Recently, another individual has applied to open still another dispensary, possibly in the Harvey West area. There are not that many people who have debilitating conditions that can't be helped by any other means. Why should we have another place?And then recently, a group called Santa Cruz Citizens for a Sensible Marijuana Policy was formed to declare their defeat in the drug war by seeking to decriminalize marijuana usage. Their petition calls for making marijuana "investigations, citations, arrests, property seizures, and prosecutions for adult marijuana offenses in the city of Santa Cruz's lowest law enforcement priority," according to their flier, and seeks to establish as policy for city officials to cry out for liberalizing changes in state and federal marijuana laws.The claimed benefit would be to free up police to fight real crimes, violent and serious crimes. And meanwhile, up at UCSC, they celebrate openly a pot smoke-out day in the spring.Let's look at the other side of the coin. A person under the influence of pot is an impaired driver. Ask someone who has lost a family member to a drug-impaired driver if the police should fight more violent and serious crimes than this? Ask a kid who has lost her mom to drugs and who is living in a foster home what a violent and serious crime is. Ask serious and violent addicts what drug they started out on. Ask the teacher who is trying to teach when there is a kid in class who is sitting there stoned. Ask the family members who go to Narc-Anon if pot is all that nonserious and nonviolent in its effects. Ask the people who have suffered home invasions by desperate addicts looking for pot, if they did not endure a serious and violent crime. Ask the hikers who have inadvertently stumbled on a pot farm way up in the woods if their lives were not in danger.Still another thought. Since there will always be rapes, shouldn't we just decriminalize rape? Same logic. Let's declare war on decriminalizing dope.City Council, let's start tightening up on that dispensary. Citizens of Santa Cruz, just declare that we are not Stoner City.Chancellor Denton, UCSC should be a place of learning, academic excellence and character development to be world-changing, not stoned out Doper City.Police Department, thanks for trying to make our city a safe place to live in spite of the dopers.Karol Delmar lives in Santa Cruz.Source: Santa Cruz Sentinel (CA)Author: Karol DelmarPublished: March 26, 2006 Copyright: 2006 Santa Cruz SentinelContact: editorial santa-cruz.comWebsite: http://www.santacruzsentinel.com/Related Articles: Marijuana Advocates Push Proposal http://cannabisnews.com/news/thread21651.shtmlMarijuana-rama http://cannabisnews.com/news/thread21552.shtmlPot Shop Lights Up The Townhttp://cannabisnews.com/news/thread21118.shtml

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Comment #118 posted by global_warming on March 28, 2006 at 16:04:29 PT
did I forget
that gracious creature named Karol Delmar ,who has some pistol up her butt,I do respect her innocent and childish place,In her euphoria and delirium,She wants to sit upon the largest Law enforcement dildo,She can ride her 'big dick,In her parade,In the meantime,Her 'prisons are getting fuller,And the rest of us,Those 'we the people,Take smaller shares,Less Interest,Less Profit,
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Comment #117 posted by global_warming on March 28, 2006 at 15:17:46 PT
re:108
The hazards of gluttony and power can easily be seen in that 'fat crowd called the US congress, it is sad to see that these people not only abuse the "system", since all that money and power most easily can abuse not only this US Constitution, but every manner of perversity, whether it be some congressional page or drug, in the meantime, most decent and civilized human beings are allowed only some little bit of information, some little bit of "Freedom, while the 'legislature takes a recess to more fully digest their disgrace.Cannabis is not the only thing in this world that needs emancipation, but free and good people in this world are also looking for that next free breath, that breath that was "given" by the forces that have shaped this reality, the forces that sustain this "universe"
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Comment #116 posted by jose melendez on March 28, 2006 at 15:13:18 PT
jiu jitsu activism: a haiku
prohibitionists'name calling shows the world thatthey already lost - jiu jitsu activism: a haiku 
Copyright 2006 by Jose MelendezAll rights reserved
Stoner v. City
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Comment #115 posted by whig on March 28, 2006 at 13:06:38 PT
Cannabis is food
Like chocolate.Some day I'd love to eat a bowl of yummy cannabis ice cream.
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Comment #114 posted by Hope on March 28, 2006 at 13:05:05 PT
Oh My Gosh!
The prohibition is to keep us from thinking like they don't want us to think. It's a prohibition of thoughts!?It makes radicals? It makes Jazz? 
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Comment #113 posted by Hope on March 28, 2006 at 12:56:20 PT
I think FoM is right.
We know it's not about poison.It's got to be about thinking and what you're thinking.They said it was...but...You know...It makes a degenerate race think this or that.Damn!
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Comment #112 posted by Hope on March 28, 2006 at 12:53:54 PT
Chocolate!
108Don't give them any ideas, Whig!I can hear it now. "If we can save just one dog."
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Comment #111 posted by Hope on March 28, 2006 at 12:50:36 PT
Dreams that would have scared Stephen King.
That's bad.
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Comment #110 posted by FoM on March 28, 2006 at 12:39:58 PT
Potential For Abuse
That really is an interesting term whig. This is why I believe they mind Cannabis. Cannabis allows a person to slow down and think. When we think we question and use reason to sort things out. Cannabis isn't a good substance that makes people follow very easily. Independent thinking has always been a threat and has in their opinion a potential for abuse by cannabis consumers.
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Comment #109 posted by whig on March 28, 2006 at 12:33:05 PT
FoM
Btw, I bet Stephen King's had a few dreams that scared even Stephen King. :)
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Comment #108 posted by whig on March 28, 2006 at 12:26:32 PT
FoM
Re: Legal pharmaceuticals vs Illicit drugsThe reason why certain things are scheduled is called their "potential for abuse." This is an interesting term, because what does it actually mean? A drug which is pleasant to use, which provides good feelings.Drugs which cause one to feel bad, with unpleasant "side-effects" are not liable to be prohibited. They don't have a "potential for abuse."But of course this is insane and monstrous. It's a language game. First of all, there's no actual such thing as "side-effects." Everything has effects but whether they are called primary or not has to do with what effects are considered (by the government) desirable . But what is desirable from their standpoint does not include what may be desirable from the standpoint of the person actually using them. In this terminology, medicinal cannabis has "side-effects" that include the very effects that most recreational users would consider primary.But let's consider food. How about chocolate? It's a drug, even, which is at least psychologically addictive for some people. It causes feelings of pleasure which, from a medical perspective, would be undesirable "side-effects." In fact, these "side-effects" are probably far more significant than any "medical benefit" of chocolate. Chocolate has some negative health consequences, too. It can cause headaches, not to mention obesity when consumed to excess. Chocolate has been found toxic to some animals, including dogs. Should chocolate be banned?
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Comment #107 posted by FoM on March 28, 2006 at 12:01:13 PT
Hope
When I was going thru withdrawal from drugs years ago I had dreams that would have scared Stephen King. I don't have dreams that I remember normally. I took a couple Valarian Root last night and slept from about 1 until after 9 this morning and woke up refreshed but still with a cold.
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Comment #106 posted by Hope on March 28, 2006 at 11:54:20 PT
FoM and Jose
FoM, that's odd that you mention that drug causing you to have strange dreams. There is one that my mother can't take. She says if she does she dreams about people that she knows that are dead. Always! That's nerve wracking.Cool dog, Jose. My husband laughed when he saw the picture. He shouted, "Camoflaged!"Blue looks like a sweetie.
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Comment #105 posted by FoM on March 28, 2006 at 11:37:16 PT
A Correction
I say I've been drug free since 94 but I am thinking of drugs that are mood altering or addicting and must be prescribed by a Doctor. Aspirin is a drug and I will take a decongestant for my sinuses when necessary. There I feel better.
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Comment #104 posted by FoM on March 28, 2006 at 09:27:08 PT
Toker00
I have been drug free since 94. I had dental surgery a number of years ago and took a narcotic pain reliever for a few days. This time I couldn't take the pain in my head and it did help that but the next night I took one I became restless, agitated and when I finally fell asleep I had vivid dreams of people I knew that now our dead. I really am getting annoyed with how they treat cannabis and then allow these drugs for people to take. Hey I didn't care about the things I normally care about while taking that drug. Maybe that's what they want.
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Comment #103 posted by Toker00 on March 28, 2006 at 09:19:11 PT
Ok, Jose,
quit foolin'. Where's the dog?!? LOL. Great pic! Had Enough, my dachs get up on the back of my couch and howl back and forth for about five minutes, every time I leave if it is during the day. It is heart warming music to my ears.We don't NEED no stinkin' drugs,do we, FoM? We have Natural Medicine! Well, at least those of us who are able to take that freedom. We must break the bonds of societal prejudice against cannabists! Unite to bring the END about! The END of CANNABIS PROHIBITION!Wage peace on war. END CANNABIS PROHIBITION NOW!
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Comment #102 posted by FoM on March 28, 2006 at 07:25:16 PT
Jose
Cool dog. I just love dogs. Dogs and horses were my passion but now it's just dogs. I'm just too old to mess with horses anymore.
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Comment #101 posted by jose melendez on March 28, 2006 at 07:18:21 PT
a shoe-out
my blue dog, Blue:http://www.signtrailers.com/img/blue.jpg
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Comment #100 posted by FoM on March 28, 2006 at 07:17:33 PT
Had Enough 
My dogs are great. He does watch over us. We have a fenced in back yard for them but the one you can barely see in the picture is an escape artist so we have to put her on a chain. She is a hunter and our good neighbor has free range chickens that come over here to visit and I am afraid she will kill one of them and they are very pretty and I want to avoid that.We also have an opossum that eats cat food with our cats at night. I love country living.
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Comment #99 posted by Had Enough on March 28, 2006 at 07:09:50 PT
Mans Best Friend
Nice pup FoM. Iíll bet he watches out over you. Iíll bet he even follows you room to room. My "Baby Girl" is lying right next to the chair I'm in. When I go outside, she follows. When I leave, my bride says she gets all mopey and lies by the gate until I get back. She is always happy to see me when I get back home.Toker00. Glad to see everything turned out good for you and your dogs.People who pet dogs live a longer, and better life.
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Comment #98 posted by FoM on March 28, 2006 at 06:50:57 PT
Toker00
He is a big dog and a fun dog. I am feeling better. We are planning to start work on the house in the next couple of weeks. We are only going to work two days a week and take it slow and stretch it over the summer. We have dirt and no grass around where the dogs are in the picture because of the excavating last year. I'll tell you I tried different drugs to help me while I've been sick and they are no good. I took a powerful pain reliever and had nightmares and I couldn't sleep. Drugs are so nasty and I'm glad I don't need to take them. 
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Comment #97 posted by Toker00 on March 28, 2006 at 03:43:18 PT
Now that's a dog!
Thanks FoM. How are you? I hope by now you are feeling "almost" normal. Another week or so...and you'll be fine! lol. I'm glad you found some relief (med.). I used Nyquil a couple times, and BC powders. I don't think either worked very well, but I convinced myself they did. After three weeks, I am now cough free. (By the way, my little Molly Jane is so happy! She is playing and twisting and doing things she hasn't done since puppydom. Elvis is like, totally envolved with her. Thank God for Vets!)Stoner City, Safer City, or Saner City? What's the DIFFERENCE? If the medcan laws get struck down, it will become Satanic City.I'm getting really anxious for November when I can bring down my mighty pen and cast out the Demonic Congressmen who continue to force humans to suffer the lies of Satan. God knew the Joy and Usefullness cannabis would give us. The laws against cannabis were clearly thought through by Satanic Cultists (skull and bones) who wrote them. Even if they weren't S&Bers, if they agreed to this, they are DEMONIC! CAST OUT THE DEMONS IN CONGRESS!!!!!!!Wage peace on war. END CANNABIS PROHIBITION NOW!
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Comment #96 posted by whig on March 28, 2006 at 00:12:25 PT
OT: Had Enough
More on Newt's escapades.http://tinyurl.com/eoqpr
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Comment #95 posted by FoM on March 27, 2006 at 18:38:01 PT
Toker00
This is off topic but I wanted to show you a picture of my Rott that Stick took today. His name is Kaptain. He is grumbly but sweet. A typical male. I couldn't resist saying that.
My Rott
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Comment #94 posted by Had Enough on March 27, 2006 at 18:12:35 PT
Cess Pool
Next thing you know they will be digging up septic tanks to pee test.Maybe I shouldn't offer any ideas.
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Comment #93 posted by Had Enough on March 27, 2006 at 18:02:08 PT
Still Shazzammed
Pee Testing a crapper plant. Amazing, just amazing!!!Bladder police are moving into new territory. Before it's all over with, there will be pipelines from our toilets right to the Bladder Content Officials.
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Comment #92 posted by Hope on March 27, 2006 at 17:44:38 PT
Waste water search
It is a stupid waste of funds...but it's sent out after other funds in their minds. "We find lots of coke in the water...we get a government grant to study it and worry it and ..." They just won't give up on the drug scare business. It's manipulative. It's not informative or protective...it's manipulative and that is all.When will people wake up?
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Comment #91 posted by Had Enough on March 27, 2006 at 17:14:41 PT
Just about the time you think........
Comment #88Clicked on the link. Just about the time you think there can't be anymore lame ways to waste money. Shazzamm, Shazzamm, Shazzamm. There it goes again. This is really crazy. All the good things tax money can do, if used responsibly, and this is how they spend it. At a WASTE WATER treatment plant.
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Comment #90 posted by Hope on March 27, 2006 at 15:42:16 PT
They went from enforcement of laws
to being our "Keepers".Lord...it's hell to be "presided" over....as someone termed it yesterday.About teachers wanting kids on Ritalin...first of all they shouldn't have become teachers if they didn't like children.Only my youngest was possibly subject to urine tests. Parents had to sign if they wanted it done...and I did not. He later told me..."They always said in DARE and stuff that someone would offer me drugs. I was kind of disappointed. No one ever offered me drugs."A lot of people suggested I put him on Ritalin...especially a neighbor who was a teacher who despised children it seemed to me.I didn't. He was quite a bit the little monster most of the time...but that did not indicate at all to me that he needed some sort of medication. If I had entertained such advice...he would not have been able to serve in the military...which he did...and very well....and he would not have been able to be a part of the career in which he now excels at.
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Comment #89 posted by Hope on March 27, 2006 at 15:25:46 PT
Karol Delmar
(Sounds like a movie star's name, doesn't it?)Karol Delmar wants to make it against the law to percieve any law to be unjust. She wants to make it against the law to disagree with a law. She wants it to be against the law to disagree with the government. She wants...What a very thoughtless woman or person she appears to be.When she percieves what she deems to be lesser beings engaged in an effort to change a law...she wants to make them criminals. She wants them to be persecuted and prosecuted.Who is she the Queen of?
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Comment #88 posted by JR Bob Dobbs on March 27, 2006 at 15:08:30 PT
Urine testing, supersized
They're actually going to test an entire town's toilet-flush for cocaine metabolites. While they're at it, they should look for the billions this drug war flushes down the toilet... 
http://www.wtopnews.com/index.php?nid=25&sid=737418
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Comment #87 posted by global_warming on March 27, 2006 at 14:41:45 PT
Beggars Row
Masons Apron,It was not a teacher, it was a cop, a police officer, Who looked at my arms,That was in the early fifties,Wish this was a better world,
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Comment #86 posted by whig on March 27, 2006 at 14:41:27 PT
Over at Unclaimed Territory
I have a few responses up on this thread today:http://tinyurl.com/ebr6aSame thread I posted about earlier today, but I thought some of you might want to check out the subsequent comments. Feel free to jump in!
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Comment #85 posted by FoM on March 27, 2006 at 14:37:30 PT
Another Comment
Last night we talked about drugs and drugging children and drug use in general. Our friend has always worked in the mental health field. I told him the problem I had in school. I bounced all over and just couldn't learn very well. He said I had ADD and that's why when I took a diet pill it helped me. He said children that have ADD are children that are bored. They don't need drugs but they need to do more then they are doing to keep their minds stimulated.
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Comment #84 posted by global_warming on March 27, 2006 at 14:22:20 PT
he made me roll up my sleeves
so that he could look at my arms,to see with his eyes, my arms,he was looking for 'needle marks,yet he wanted me to undress,before his eye.
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Comment #83 posted by Hope on March 27, 2006 at 14:21:50 PT
The Teachers are the only ones I've ever known
of to suggest that a child should absolutely have them.No pusher....no dealer....the teacher.
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Comment #82 posted by global_warming on March 27, 2006 at 14:15:22 PT
yes
the teacher
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Comment #81 posted by Hope on March 27, 2006 at 14:06:19 PT
Anyone at school try to get your kid on drugs?
TEACHERS!
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Comment #80 posted by global_warming on March 27, 2006 at 14:05:50 PT
top of the mountain
where the air is free..cooking on some charcoal embers presently,downlaoding some Celtic music from usenet, some bagpipe music, from the grace in Coyote.Just standing by that river, waiting to get a peek, 
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Comment #79 posted by FoM on March 27, 2006 at 13:52:12 PT
 global_warming 
You could be right.
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Comment #78 posted by global_warming on March 27, 2006 at 13:46:38 PT
that may be "THE Gateway DRUG
Ritalin, it is not Cannabis, For have not so many 'MILLIONS" of people tried the leaf of that plant that has been given, and some are presidents, lawyers and priests.
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Comment #77 posted by Hope on March 27, 2006 at 13:43:17 PT
They keep giving it to them as long as they
will take it. Even as adults.It will keep you out of the military....and some jobs. FOREVER!
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Comment #76 posted by Hope on March 27, 2006 at 13:41:58 PT
oh dread
Over at Grits for Breakfast. http://gritsforbreakfast.blogspot.com/Tea-leaf readers were right on Chief Justice Roberts and the Fourth Amendment
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Comment #75 posted by FoM on March 27, 2006 at 13:40:49 PT
A Thought and a Question
I bet a whole lot of children that were prescribed Ritalin when they stopped taking Ritalin went on to Cocaine or Meth. It would set them up to move on in my opinion to illegal substances. What age do Doctors stop giving Ritalin to children?
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Comment #74 posted by Hope on March 27, 2006 at 13:33:47 PT
Ritalin
It IS a diet pill! They don't eat much. Infinitely less than they did before the ritalin. At least every single child I ever knew that was on it or one of it's relatives responded that way to taking it. It's a diet pill.
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Comment #73 posted by FoM on March 27, 2006 at 13:24:41 PT
Ritalin
Our friend that just visited commented on Ritalin. He said he took one once and he was speeding his brains out. That's an old expression we used years ago. He said it was as powerful as any of the good diet pills we got back in the 70s and they give it to kids!
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Comment #72 posted by Hope on March 27, 2006 at 13:21:29 PT
I like this, too...but they'd likely nix it.
"It sounds like Karol has some deep connection with Law Enforcement in this town, who can say, maybe she is married to one of those good old boys who just can't stop saying no to this and no to that..life must be a wee bit difficult living around someone who yells out "NO..at everything you do,..get a real life."Might be a dad or granddad, too. Or who knows...maybe her mother or grandmother was a leo.
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Comment #71 posted by Hope on March 27, 2006 at 13:16:50 PT
Brilliant, gw....
"Imagine, Karol Delmar may live in Santa Cruz, yet she sounds so confused, "Ask the teacher who is trying to teach when there is a kid in class who is sitting there stoned." Now Karol, did you ever stop to think for a minute, maybe that Ritalin might have something to do with this?"E-Mail! E-Mail!editorial santa-cruz.com
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Comment #70 posted by FoM on March 27, 2006 at 13:16:13 PT
global_warming 
Thank you. I am feeling better. A little better each day. Soon I will be back on top of the mountain. The worst is over thank goodness. I'm just very tired now.
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Comment #69 posted by global_warming on March 27, 2006 at 13:11:46 PT
that is some article -above
Hope you are feeling better Lady FOMME,Imagine, Karol Delmar may live in Santa Cruz, yet she sounds so confused, "Ask the teacher who is trying to teach when there is a kid in class who is sitting there stoned." Now Karol, did you ever stop to think for a minute, maybe that Ritalin might have something to do with this?"Still another thought. Since there will always be rapes, shouldn't we just decriminalize rape? " This is where it gets interesting, a rape "VICTIM" is clearly a tangible victim, yet who has been victimized when taking Cannabis? Hopefully, Karol, there will not "always be rapes", the glass is either half empty or half full."Police Department, thanks for trying to make our city a safe place to live in spite of the dopers."It sounds like Karol has some deep connection with Law Enforcement in this town, who can say, maybe she is married to one of those good old boys who just can't stop saying no to this and no to that..life must be a wee bit difficult living around someone who yells out "NO..at everything you do,..get a real life.
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Comment #68 posted by Hope on March 27, 2006 at 13:07:15 PT
Political Manipulators
Manipulators don't realize it's a level playing field.
 
They see themselves as the top of the mountain and everything slopes down from them. They have to keep gathering things back to themselves because it always seems like it is rolling away.
 
They are very condescending to those they manipulate or attempt to manipulate.
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Comment #67 posted by FoM on March 27, 2006 at 12:56:27 PT
Had Enough 
I don't like politicians in general but there is something about the ones on the right that really irritate me. 
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Comment #66 posted by Had Enough on March 27, 2006 at 12:47:53 PT
Goose & Ganders
I'm thinkin Newt Gingrich. This fine upstanding Republican pillar of society, had an affair with one of his staff members & dumped his wife.Here is his website, doesn't mention it at all, but I didn't spend very long looking at it. I just had a late lunch.Caution; those with a weak stomach, keep bucket nearby.http://www.newt.org/
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Comment #65 posted by FoM on March 27, 2006 at 12:15:38 PT

Problem With Democrats
I think I know one of the reasons why Democrats are considered wishy washy. They don't sling a lot of mud. Republicans are a hateful bunch. They don't seem to hesitate to tell everyone what idiots we are if we don't agree with them. They call us commies and nasty names. If a democrat has a side line love life they will crucify them publically. Republicans dwell on things that irk people so then people join them and cast stones. Maybe it is jealousy. I say live and let live and who cares what people do privately. It doesn't matter to me. What matters is how are we going to fix the problems of poverty and the rich getting richer and the poor getting poorer.
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Comment #64 posted by Had Enough on March 27, 2006 at 12:00:22 PT

Sticks & Stones
Hope. Yes we do have a stick. The ballot box. Just keep replacing politicians, until they get the message. Some are already getting it.

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Comment #63 posted by Hope on March 27, 2006 at 11:55:37 PT

Nope, Lombar.
"Now me 'pushing' my values upon others is just as bad as them doing it to us..."You are speaking softly. They are using weapons, brutality, and incarceration to convince us. We are walking softly and we don't even have a big stick.
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Comment #62 posted by whig on March 27, 2006 at 11:36:45 PT

Hope
"Maybe they think alcohol/cocaine is macho or cool and not like that wimpy hippy stuff. They want something that can make them mean, cause mean is good. Reckon?"Nah. Speaking from my own experience with non-cannabis things, and having "converted," it was a very difficult transition. Cannabis was not kind to me at first. I had extreme paranoia. Dry mouth. Distrust. Discomfort. I just did not like it.I made a deliberate attempt to get comfortable with cannabis. I felt it was important to be able to understand this plant, to have a relationship with it. Starting as I did with Salvia divinorum, I called this learning experience, "When Mary met Sally."Of all the things I've experienced, and I've tried a lot of things, nothing was more potent, more powerful, more life transforming, than cannabis, but lest this seem a warning, the change it brought was for the better.I was a paranoid, scared, hurting person. Sometimes I was angry, and sometimes I lashed out. I was not violent, but I was capable of being deliberately hurtful when I felt injured. I know how the prohibs think, because once upon a time I even shared their mindset. Cannabis is very uncomfortable for such people.Alcohol, however, it dulls what cannabis emphasizes. It's very comforting for the paranoids.We know this without knowing that we know it. We hear all the time that cannabis causes paranoia. It does not. It only brings out the paranoia that is already present in order for us to deal with it, to resolve it, to become non-paranoid. Cannabis, used properly, is a tool to heal the psyche.
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Comment #61 posted by Hope on March 27, 2006 at 11:22:53 PT

Sam....comment 18 Strange but True.
"In my circles of friends over the years, I've found that people who like to "party" fall into 2 categories: alcohol/cocaine, and cannabis. It's easy to peg the ones in the first group, they always turn down cannabis until the very end of the evening - because it interferes with their drinking. These people are usually the ones who eagerly do cocaine as well."Maybe they think alcohol/cocaine is macho or cool and not like that wimpy hippy stuff. They want something that can make them mean, cause mean is good. Reckon?
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Comment #60 posted by Hope on March 27, 2006 at 11:17:04 PT

Lombar  post 15....Huzza! Huzza!
"What 'high horse' are drug warriors on and what started their desire to be oppressive? What is the gateway to their addiction to VIOLENCE?(deprivaion of liberty, health, and lives)""What about the cannabis using people who suffer armed incursions into their home by police. Ask them if they did not endure a serious and violent crime?"
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Comment #59 posted by Hope on March 27, 2006 at 10:58:09 PT

Runderwo  comment 44
Thanks. I sent one, too...but I havn't got a call on it, so they likely aren't going to use it.Somebody needs to be printed in answer to that ridiculous bunch of statements.You did what you could. That's all any of us can do.(Just little ole ants in the scheme of things...but we might move that rubber tree yet.)
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Comment #58 posted by FoM on March 27, 2006 at 10:13:58 PT

whig
I don't know if Mexico would want to become the 51st state. I just threw it out as an idea because we need to be fair to people who aren't from Mexico as well as those from Mexico in my opinion. I don't like slave labor. 
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Comment #57 posted by FoM on March 27, 2006 at 10:10:55 PT

ekim
Our friend that now lives in Yuma, Arizona told us about how tunnels are all over the place down there. He was looking at property for sale with a real estate agent. It was just bare land but he noticed a stack coming up from the ground. He asked the real estate agent what is that. He said probably a chimney. He said but it's underground. They walked over towards it and he tripped on something. The something was a hidden trap door. They opened it up and went into it and there were bunk beds. He said I know what this is and he said I'm not interested in this land because the cops will come after me thinking I would be involved. 
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Comment #56 posted by whig on March 27, 2006 at 10:06:49 PT

FoM
What makes you think Mexico would want to become part of the United States?No human being is illegal.No plant is illegal.There's a lot of similarity in these issues.
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Comment #55 posted by ekim on March 27, 2006 at 10:03:16 PT

end cannabis prohibition
Monday, March 27, 2006 
Why interdiction fails
http://lastonespeaks.blogspot.com/
So they're talking about building a wall along the Mexican border to keep out illegal immigrants and presumably to also to thwart drug smugglers. It's never going to work, not as long as border guards are tempted by the big bucks of black market bribery. 
U.S. Customs Inspector Lizandro Martinez is behind bars, suspected of taking more than $1 million in bribes while waving through more than 50 tons of drugs ó more than his law-abiding colleagues seized at eight South Texas ports of entry in an entire year.
Like they say, everybody has a price and a million bucks is tough to turn down for simply waving through a few trucks. More proof that the only way to end drug smuggling is to legalize drugs.
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Comment #54 posted by FoM on March 27, 2006 at 09:44:23 PT

nuexo mexican
Timing is very important. Neil won't do things unless the cycle of the moon is right.
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Comment #53 posted by FoM on March 27, 2006 at 09:42:57 PT

Interesting Comments on The Protests
We took much of the south from the Mexicans. I know that if someone took my land I would never believe it wasn't my land so I understand how they feel. We need health care for all lower income people not just people who come here from Mexico. Those who produce our food need health coverage and a living wage like we all need. This whole issue is very complex. Why not make Mexico the 51st state?
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Comment #52 posted by Toker00 on March 27, 2006 at 09:40:55 PT

nuexo mexican
You are exactly right to call for a protest when nature is alligned just so. This is what I mean about returning to Natural Law. According to natural cycles and such. There certainly is a time for everything, and man has offset this delicate balance because of his thirst to control it. It will never happen. Nature Knows Best.Toke.
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Comment #51 posted by Toker00 on March 27, 2006 at 09:34:01 PT

I don't know FoM.
These people are not even legal Americans, but they get more coverage than any of our domestic policy protests. We get ten seconds, they get thirty minutes. They get better health coverage than our working poor. What I think is this. Ameicans are afraid to protest because someone has convinced them they might be jailed. And it HAS happened. But listen. Most protestors are arrested for pushing their luck or just downright stupid things. A well organized protest will avoid the pitfalls. Even when we DO protest, it is not in huge numbers, not loud enough, not long enough. When was the last time 500,000 Americans got behind one issue like the Mexican immigrants have? The Million Man March? Where is our show of solidarity? It has been effectively decapitated by mental images of Jackboots wrestling you to the ground, gassing, beating and throwing you in patty wagons like you see on the news. That is a very, very, rare occurrance. I attended around ten protest last year, and the only people I know of who got arrested were either anarchists who tried to imtimidate the police, or someone who didn't do as the organizers told them to do. But you know what? Maybe the anarchists have it right. Screw ALL government.Wage peace on war. END CANNABIS PROHIBITION NOW! 
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Comment #50 posted by siege on March 27, 2006 at 09:33:05 PT

FoM
When Ray-gun was in office he passed a Bill:: It said, that [ IF A ILLEGAL MEXICAN JUST HIDE FROM THE COPS AND STAY FOR A YEAR THEY HAD CITIZENSHIP HERE.] So yes there going to show the trash. 
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Comment #49 posted by nuevo mexican on March 27, 2006 at 09:29:30 PT

bush wants immigrants to become felons, FOM
The next anti-war protest must be appropriately scheduled, 
like the one on Feb. 15, 2002, when 15-30 million marched, (and that DIDN'T stop the war).It can happen again, now that we have a new model, and you are right, we have to have a huge turnout the NEXT time, or this war will last our lives.It's no coincidence that it was a FULL MOON in Aquarius/Leo, the sign of humanitarianism, as in the 'AGE of AQUarius' that prompted so many to march, but since many political activists, including Cannabis activists, dismiss the influence of the stars, we all miss out.Divine timing is the key, and that event was divinly timed, in 2002, and again, yesterday, when the Moon, Venus and Neptune transited the sign of AQuarius, and up to 1 1/2 million people marched in L.A.Last time I marched in L.A. was in 90 at the start of the Iraq war, and 300,000 marched, it was awesome. so the deal with the success of the march was due to: good timing, the Catholic church and spanish media were huge supporters, AND these people are on the right side of the issue, as we are hyprocrites it seems, as noone but the native Americans, were 'the first' to be here, and we ALL are immigrants aren't we.The U.S. has been exposed for it's hypocrisy, and it looks like a done deal!
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Comment #48 posted by FoM on March 27, 2006 at 08:51:43 PT

Why All The Protests?
I want to know why so many people are protesting about the Mexico border issue. What do they want from us? Why don't they show anti-war protests when they happen like they are showing these protests?
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Comment #47 posted by Had Enough on March 27, 2006 at 07:36:44 PT

Links
A link, inside Whigís linkAUSTIN - A civil rights lawsuit announced Wednesday blames the private corrections system for the 2004 suicide of a South Texas woman found hanging in her cell after reporting that a male inmate raped her. 
LeTisha Tapia, who died at the Val Verde County Jail in July 2004, was housed in the same cell block as male inmates and reported that guards allowed male and female inmates to have sex with each other, according to the lawsuit filed by the Texas Civil Rights Project on behalf of the woman's family. ÖÖÖ.http://www.chron.com/CDA/archives/archive.mpl?id=2006_4062799

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Comment #46 posted by whig on March 27, 2006 at 06:50:14 PT

Reading
http://tinyurl.com/ebr6a
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Comment #45 posted by mayan on March 26, 2006 at 23:42:23 PT

Enough Said
Still another thought. Since there will always be rapes, shouldn't we just decriminalize rape? Same logic. Let's declare war on decriminalizing dope.Hee-Hee! 
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Comment #44 posted by runderwo on March 26, 2006 at 20:45:25 PT

Hope
I rewrote the response into a LTE and sent it, we'll see if it goes to print.
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Comment #43 posted by Had Enough on March 26, 2006 at 18:51:50 PT

Big Time - Prime Time
larger than life...Karol Delmar. Prime example of how, "The mind can be a terrible thing." Big Time!!!Saddam Hussein would have been pleased to have her on his staff.

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Comment #42 posted by Had Enough on March 26, 2006 at 18:31:30 PT

"Still another thought"
"Still another thought. Since there will always be rapes, shouldn't we just decriminalize rape? Same logic."Our, misguided Karol Delmar here, seems to be confused on the subject of rape. Well maybe a read here will help her clarify things.Stop Prison Rapehttp://www.spr.org/

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Comment #41 posted by Hope on March 26, 2006 at 17:57:03 PT

Lombar
"How can true happiness be acheived and suffering overcome when the world, the consumer culture rewards greed? When furtherance of such culture is done through war? When leaders do not or can not be honest?"That seems to be what we are... War mongers and greedy consumers.

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Comment #40 posted by Hope on March 26, 2006 at 17:37:35 PT

Thinking about Karol's wants and needs
just before I started reading your post, Lombar. I'm so sorry. I brought it up in another window!
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Comment #39 posted by Hope on March 26, 2006 at 17:35:36 PT

Sorry....
I had that comment aside...the last one...for probably an hour or three! I didn't realize that I'd posted it on the same thread we were conversing on, Lombar! Sorry....That made me sound so rude.I even get myself misunderstood on the internet. 
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Comment #38 posted by Hope on March 26, 2006 at 17:21:43 PT

So Karol wants to have another war?
The cause of all wars and conflicts? Is it not hatred and/or greed and/or ignorance?Hatred, Greed, and Ignorance.What a hideous trio.

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Comment #37 posted by lombar on March 26, 2006 at 16:55:41 PT

It's an excerpt
.. from the link to access to insight dot org.They have been thinking about it for a long time, without the distractions of our lives. I really like that stuff, I have been reading it for about a decade, really heavy at first. I must have taken most of the books on buddhism out of the library and read them when I first got interested.Start with the four noble truths, then try and grasp depenedent co-arising, and then its a matter of cutting the roots of mental patterns that cause you (or others) to suffer. All actions proceed from an intent. To do this one supposedly must lose all their attachments to the material (the reason for just robes, homelessness, and a bowl) to attain concentration. This is where one is supposed to fully grasp the cause-effect nature of dependent co-arising. ------------------------------
(clipped from text)Unlike the Jains, the Buddha taught that this bondage was mental rather than physical. It was caused not by sticky substances created by the physical violence of an act, but by the fact that, when there is ignorance of the four noble truths [III/H/i] (a subtle form of delusion, the most basic root of unskillfulness), the feeling that results from kamma gives rise to craving (a subtle form of greed and aversion), clinging, and becoming; and these, in turn, form the conditions for further kamma. Thus the results of action, in the presence of ignorance, breed the conditions for more action, creating feedback loops that keep the kammic processes in motion. For this reason, the Buddha defined the effluents as clinging ó expressed in some lists as sensuality, in others as sensuality and views ó together with becoming and the ignorance that underlies them all. If ignorance of the four truths can be ended, however, feeling does not form a condition for craving or clinging, and thus there is no becoming to provide a realm for further kamma.------------How can true happiness be acheived and suffering overcome when the world, the consumer culture rewards greed? When furtherance of such culture is done through war? When leaders do not or can not be honest?
Wings to Awakening
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Comment #36 posted by Hope on March 26, 2006 at 16:52:18 PT

Similar...but different "meditations" can 
get you over "him", too...should that ever appear as a necessity."The meditation can then be developed towards him, remembering endearing words or virtues of his, and thinking such thoughts about him as "may he be happy." (In this way the full absorption of contemplation, in which the word-meditation is left behind, can be attained.)"

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Comment #35 posted by Hope on March 26, 2006 at 16:50:04 PT

"That does not happen to me everyday"
That's good!""May I keep myself free from hostility and trouble and live happily"" An excellent prayer, hope, mantra....whatever you use it for...it's good.I also sometimes pray at that point that he who I hope in will go before me and after me and to either side of me and above and below me and see that as much "hostility" and "trouble" are cleared away or eliminated before I arrive and after I leave as he can manage in his power.I "Amen" myself!
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Comment #34 posted by Hope on March 26, 2006 at 16:43:54 PT

Beautiful!
 It is by cultivating the thought "May I be happy" with oneself as example, that one begins to be interested in the welfare and happiness of other living beings, and to feel in some sense their happiness as if it were one's own: "Just as I want happiness and fear pain, just as I want to live and not to die, so do other beings." So one should first become familiar with pervading oneself as example with loving-kindness. Only then should one choose someone who is liked and admired and much respected. The meditation can then be developed towards him, remembering endearing words or virtues of his, and thinking such thoughts about him as "may he be happy." (In this way the full absorption of contemplation, in which the word-meditation is left behind, can be attained.)"

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Comment #33 posted by Hope on March 26, 2006 at 16:42:22 PT

"May I be happy" 
I grew up with that mantra inadvertantly."May I be happy? Will someone tell me why I may not? As soon as someone sees I'm happy or simply may be headed in that direction, they often appear to be hell bent to destroy it...or the possibility of it. "May I be happy? What's the problem? May I be happy?""Hmmm?"May I be happy?.Yes, I may. And I may well have Joy, too.
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Comment #32 posted by Hope on March 26, 2006 at 16:35:59 PT

That
can really get you in trouble.I can get in that sort of trouble without saying a word!
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Comment #31 posted by Hope on March 26, 2006 at 16:35:07 PT

I can understand that...for sure.
"Then there are certain types of persons towards whom loving-kindness should not be developed in the first stages. 
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Comment #30 posted by Hope on March 26, 2006 at 16:26:25 PT

Can't quite grasp it all yet, but seems brilliant.
"Then there are certain types of persons towards whom loving-kindness should not be developed in the first stages. The attempt, at the outset to regard a disliked person as dear to one is fatiguing, and likewise trying to regard a dearly loved friend with neutrality, and when an enemy is recalled anger springs up. Again it should not be directed towards members of the opposite sex, to begin with, for this may arouse lust. Right at the start, the meditation of loving-kindness should be developed towards oneself repeatedly in this way: "May I be happy and free from suffering" or "May I keep myself free from hostility and trouble and live happily" (though this will never produce the full absorption of contemplation). It is by cultivating the thought "May I be happy" with oneself as example, that one begins to be interested in the welfare and happiness of other living beings, and to feel in some sense their happiness as if it were one's own: "Just as I want happiness and fear pain, just as I want to live and not to die, so do other beings." So one should first become familiar with pervading oneself as example with loving-kindness. Only then should one choose someone who is liked and admired and much respected. The meditation can then be developed towards him, remembering endearing words or virtues of his, and thinking such thoughts about him as "may he be happy." (In this way the full absorption of contemplation, in which the word-meditation is left behind, can be attained.)"
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Comment #29 posted by Hope on March 26, 2006 at 16:18:53 PT

"The Show Must Go On"
And "The Road Goes on Forever" and "The Story Never Ends".
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Comment #28 posted by Hope on March 26, 2006 at 16:15:51 PT

Amazing and Admirable Self-Control.
Lombar.
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Comment #27 posted by lombar on March 26, 2006 at 16:15:14 PT

That does not happen to me everyday
...but I think that the perversity of the universe tends towards the maximum so once you think you have got a good bead on things, the universe proves you wrong.Is adversity easier to accept with the belief that it is instructive? To view all events, positive or negative as learning experiences, does this lessen the sting?There is a forest monestary not 300 miles from here ;), I have been getting more and more tempted to load up on some supplies for them and just go there for a month to study with some real monks .. . I just read the stuff and try and figure it out myself but perhaps there is more that is not in writing. Love thy neighbor might be easier if he's several miles away.. ;)
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Comment #26 posted by Hope on March 26, 2006 at 16:08:20 PT

Lombar....
Oh my gosh!(still reading)
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Comment #25 posted by Hope on March 26, 2006 at 15:46:18 PT

Lol! Oh ....Lord!
I'm still reading Lombar...but I had to say that.
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Comment #24 posted by lombar on March 26, 2006 at 15:30:58 PT

Cannabis is not a gateway..
.. it's a terminus. :) Last night I had an encounter with someone who was really psychotic. This person made some racial oriented comment, something about some colored lady in line at the cafe. He claimed this woman disrespected him so I asked how. This led to this person saying 'do you want to fight me' after about 30 seconds. All I did was disagree a little and ask why he was offended.."you must be a pinko commy" - he actually said that.
" I must be" - unphased
"Do you wanna fight me?"
"Did I say that?"
- at this point my other friend started to intervene. it took 15 seconds to reach the point of possible violence.Now I am a person who values peace but sometimes peace is not being passive. So I said a few things and the third party present tried to intervene and stop it. Now I would not have fought this person, I would have had him arrested. Various scenarios passed thru my mind for a few minutes, none of them nice.All the while this person listed their severe psychiatric problems, he had his hand on the primary cause, a case of beer. He was and is a danger to society, two words can inspire him to violence. I found out later that he has a tattoo of a swastika and fancies himself a white supremist. Now I could understand at least what he was about and WHY he was psychotic.My initial response was anger and adrenaline. Survival, I would defend myself with whatever strength I could muster. I just shut up and let the guy babble and at some point he must have realized that he had already committed several criminal acts and had I wished, I could have really screwd his day up..As I sat in silence, thinking, 'if you attack me, I will try and kill you and feel as though I have done the world a service' and struggled very hard to go back to that place of compassion... but this person is no victim of anything but their own ignorance and delusions.. It is in those moments that you know yourself. I will not attack but niether will I yield. I wrestled with my anger rather than just expressing it (with my fist), being mindful, what did it arise from? From the fact that some other stranger must have felt pretty threatened by this person who by rights should be caged. I was offended to the core of my self. At least let someone damn themselves first, the color of their skin is not a basis to discriminate.. winners and losers come in all colors.As I sit here now I wonder why does that person have their 'drug' out in the open (although not opened), acting like an ass, talking about harsh crimes against people of color, and *I* have to slink in the shadows because I like cannabis !!! What is wrong with that picture?We have to argue, cajole, educate, and be held to crazy standards while the really dangerous psychotics are wandering around loose... with easy access to alcohol. I bet the guy is far more lucid when he smokes pot without the alcohol. The pharmas probably help too.. without the alcohol.On darker days I sometimes think that the golden rule needs to be reworked."Do unto others as they would do unto others..." which would shift the emphasis away from self control and more towards 'if thy right hand offends thee cut it off, better to lose the hand than let the whole body die'. If you believe that you have the right to kill, then that is what should be done to you... but that is on the darker days ...;) I sat in silence for about five minutes wrestling with my feelings, being disappointed somewhat that I was angered. The guy sat and talked to my other friend for awhile and must have thought better of it and apologised.---Empty spaces - what are we living forAbandoned places - I guess we know the scoreOn and on, does anybody know what we are looking for...Another hero, another mindless crimeBehind the curtain, in the pantomimeHold the line, does anybody want to take it anymoreThe show must go on,The show must go onInside my heart is breakingMy make-up may be flakingBut my smile still stays on.Whatever happens, Iíll leave it all to chanceAnother heartache, another failed romanceOn and on, does anybody know what we are living for?I guess Iím learning, I must be warmer nowIíll soon be turning, round the corner nowOutside the dawn is breakingBut inside in the dark Iím aching to be freeThe show must go onThe show must go onInside my heart is breakingMy make-up may be flakingBut my smile still stays onMy soul is painted like the wings of butterfliesFairytales of yesterday will grow but never dieI can fly - my friendsThe show must go onThe show must go onIíll face it with a grinIím never giving inOn - with the show -Iíll top the bill, Iíll overkillI have to find the will to carry onOn with the -On with the show -The show must go on...(Queen - The Show Must Go On)
------------------------"Then there are certain types of persons towards whom loving-kindness should not be developed in the first stages. The attempt, at the outset to regard a disliked person as dear to one is fatiguing, and likewise trying to regard a dearly loved friend with neutrality, and when an enemy is recalled anger springs up. Again it should not be directed towards members of the opposite sex, to begin with, for this may arouse lust. Right at the start, the meditation of loving-kindness should be developed towards oneself repeatedly in this way: "May I be happy and free from suffering" or "May I keep myself free from hostility and trouble and live happily" (though this will never produce the full absorption of contemplation). It is by cultivating the thought "May I be happy" with oneself as example, that one begins to be interested in the welfare and happiness of other living beings, and to feel in some sense their happiness as if it were one's own: "Just as I want happiness and fear pain, just as I want to live and not to die, so do other beings." So one should first become familiar with pervading oneself as example with loving-kindness. Only then should one choose someone who is liked and admired and much respected. The meditation can then be developed towards him, remembering endearing words or virtues of his, and thinking such thoughts about him as "may he be happy." (In this way the full absorption of contemplation, in which the word-meditation is left behind, can be attained.)"
Very great magic 
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Comment #23 posted by lombar on March 26, 2006 at 14:19:58 PT

Hope
I generally do not fire letters across the border. Sometimes the content is so offensive that I feel like it but I find it distasteful to interfere in the affairs of other countries. There are plenty of americans who are much more informed to comment on the local stuff. Feel free to take anything I say and paraphrase, plagerize or whatever if you find it helpful...The 'war on drugs' has been pushed on the world by the USA but its the world that has to 'push back' by changing our own laws and forcing the US to follow suit. Like slavery. Would the conservatives argued in favor of slavery because if we were to outlaw it, that would anger washington?Now me 'pushing' my values upon others is just as bad as them doing it to us... How can the good prevail when the evil can just destroy the good but good does not 'destroy' and believe their use of violence and loss of compassion to be a far greater ill than just being killed?
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Comment #22 posted by whig on March 26, 2006 at 14:07:27 PT

lombar
When I preferred other things, I did not like cannabis.Cannabis is what took me off of other drugs. People who like other drugs and don't want to stop are going to have to face some things they might not like if they become pot heads.
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Comment #21 posted by lombar on March 26, 2006 at 14:04:03 PT

I have a similar pattern Sam
People who generally prefer drinking eschew cannabis usage and prefer stimulants. Perhaps it is the craving for stims that drives the differences. As you mentioned, the herb users generally use before some activity or other. Drinkers are 'partying' and stimulants like cocaine and now meth to some extent, keep the party going longer. The underlying craving may arise from having a boring unfulfilled existence, some psychic wound or attempt to escape reality. Stimulants and opiates act directly upon the pleasure centers of the brain, replacing key neurotransmitters for a time in the case of herion. Which reminds me of the first 'Noble truth', there is suffering in life, it is 'unsatisfactory'. This 'unsatisfactoriness' is inherent in material existence and cannot be escaped by material means, ie drugs, wealth, philadelphia cream cheese and donuts. This suffering is caused by craving. Drugs are not the only things that give rise to craving, nor the only things people become obsessed with. The standards which cannabis is being held to is ridiculous given the sheer numbers of other more pressing problems.Generally speaking, I have noticed that people who prefer alcohol do not smoke the herb. Herb users imbibe to 'enhance' their lives.Drinkers drown their sorrows... or get stupidly happy.. used as a emotional release mechanism, disinhibitor.Hard drug users attempt to escape dukkha by escaping temporarily in drug induced pleasure.Drug warriors create more suffering by use of violence. Violence that is supported by deceit, paid for by the victims, and perpetuted by stuff like the above article.
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Comment #20 posted by Hope on March 26, 2006 at 13:53:38 PT

Lombar
You're hot! Fire a letter off. Now!editorial santa-cruz.com
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Comment #19 posted by Hope on March 26, 2006 at 13:50:31 PT

Runderoo....comment 13
To the editor with that!editorial santa-cruz.com

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Comment #18 posted by Sam Adams on March 26, 2006 at 13:27:40 PT

addiction
thank you people for methodically refuting all of the BS in this article.I was just going to point out that I have only 1 close friend who's been through detox & rehab for cocaine & alcohol addiction. He went almost daily to NA and AA meetings for years, he met several celebrities in the process.About 18 months into it, he said he had met only 1 person who came to a group meeting & said they were an MJ addict. He said everyone else laughed & ridiculed the person (at first, I'm sure they took him seriously after that), because to a bunch of cocaine, alcohol, and opiate addicts, someone claiming to be addicted to cannabis is a laughable joke.I used to have a report somewhere on my computer about the percentage of people seeking addiction help in my state broken down by drug. I just searched my hard drive & couldn't find it, but I believe the percent of people who VOLUNTARILY sought addiction help was like 3 or 4% for MJ, the rest for alcohol, cocaine, and heroin.btw, my friend, who is still completely recovered, although he has to be on lithium for the rest of his life, said that he hated smoking cannabis. I finally convinced him to try a small puff once, and he gagged and actually vomited a little bit. In my circles of friends over the years, I've found that people who like to "party" fall into 2 categories: alcohol/cocaine, and cannabis. It's easy to peg the ones in the first group, they always turn down cannabis until the very end of the evening - because it interferes with their drinking. These people are usually the ones who eagerly do cocaine as well.The people in the cannabis group usually like to take the herb before other activites, such as outdoor sports, games, boating, work, etc. They will usually enjoy the herb as soon as we get together, and they will usually turn down the blow and drink moderately.So I guess I'm saying that in my experience, the people really looked to get wasted usually end up developing a preference for alcohol & cocaine. Sure, they've used cannabis many times, but it definitely is not the drug that got them into trouble. 
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Comment #17 posted by lombar on March 26, 2006 at 13:19:52 PT

So its the 12 step
The AA 12 steps applied to drugs.. I went to one with a friend once who quit using crack. I have seen people who have replaced their drug habits with a new habit, NA. Whatever gets you through the day I suppose...I notice they quickly disavow any connection to the scientology program 'narconon'.. ;)
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Comment #16 posted by whig on March 26, 2006 at 13:02:12 PT

Narcanon FYI
http://www.narcanon.net/
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Comment #15 posted by lombar on March 26, 2006 at 12:59:30 PT

Should not be ...
'stupid cow' city either.Ask the families of the victims of the Federal Government how they feel about losing their child because they have been imprisioned for burning some flowers. Ask the sufferers of cancer who beleive the tripe from the federal government and refrain from using cannabis because they think its the same as cocaine or herion.Ask the people around here who have much better things to do with their lives but cannot abide the injustice and idiocy of the war on some drugs. I am sure I would rather be doing something else ...What this author fails to mention that is even IF people become drug addicts, how does PRISON help? IT is one thing to discourage people from abusing substances it is quite another to cage them for years because they ignore the first."The claimed benefit would be to free up police to fight real crimes, violent and serious crimes. "This is unrefuted. She switches to scare tactics but offers no refutation because it is IMPOSSIBLE for the 'crime' rate to do anything but fall if the USA did not arrest 700+k people per year for cannabis. so rather than offer a reason why prohibition should be maintained she scares us with people who make POOR CHOICES or victims of the law."Ask someone who has lost a family member to a drug-impaired driver if the police should fight more violent and serious crimes than this?"- poor choice to drive impaired on anything"Ask a kid who has lost her mom to drugs and who is living in a foster home what a violent and serious crime is."- what about all the orphans caused by harsh mandatory minimums? Families broken up by the state because one of them likes a bit of cannabis?"Ask serious and violent addicts what drug they started out on."It must be mothers milk. They all started with mothers milk. What 'high horse' are drug warriors on and what started their desire to be oppressive? What is the gateway to their addiction to VIOLENCE?(deprivaion of liberty, health, and lives)"Ask the teacher who is trying to teach when there is a kid in class who is sitting there stoned. "- nobody advocates pot for kids. At least if it was not illegal, the 'kid' does not have to admit being a criminal as well as a drug addict."Ask the family members who go to Narc-Anon if pot is all that nonserious and nonviolent in its effects."I seriously question the sanity of anyone who attends narc-anon. Is'nt that the one paid for by the scientologists? It's a recruiting ground for the so-called religion...maybe I am confusing it with some other program." Ask the people who have suffered home invasions by desperate addicts looking for pot, if they did not endure a serious and violent crime. "What about the cannabis using people who suffer armed incursions into their home by police. Ask them if they did not endure a serious and violent crime? Trying to make cannabis look like meth."Ask the hikers who have inadvertently stumbled on a pot farm way up in the woods if their lives were not in danger"Which would not be dangerous at all if cannabis was not worth its weight in gold.
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Comment #14 posted by Had Enough on March 26, 2006 at 12:54:29 PT

Ice Cold Water - Ms Delmar
Ask the people who have suffered home invasions by desperate addicts looking for pot, if they did not endure a serious and violent crime. Ask the hikers who have inadvertently stumbled on a pot farm way up in the woods if their lives were not in danger.End Prohibition, and these questions need not be asked.I find it interesting that Ms. Delmar uses the term rape. Seems thatís what current laws do. Rape your property and bank account if you have one. Lose your job. Not to mention what can happen while being held in a correctional facility.***********************For Runruff.Grand Funk Railroad Lyrics - Inside Looking Out Lyrics..... I'm sitting here lonely like a broken man.I serve my time doin' the best I can.Walls and bars they surround me.But, I don't want no sympathy.***No baby, no baby,All I need is some tender lovin'.To keep me sane in this burning oven.And, when my time is up, you'll be my reefer.***Life gets worse on God's green earth.Be my reefer, got to keep smokin' that thing.No, no, no, no, no, no.No, no, no, no, no, no, no.***I said now baby ... baby ..., let me smoke it ... smoke it ...Makes me feel good ... feel good, yes, I feel good ... ahhhhh ...Yes, I feel alright ... feel alright ..., yes, I feel alright ... feel alright ...Yes, I feel alright ... Ahhhhh ...
Ohhhhh ...***Ice cold water is runnin' through my veins.They try and drag me back to work again.Pain and blisters on my mind and hands.I work all day making up burlap bags.***The oats they're feeding me are driving me wild.I feel unhappy like a new born child.Now, when my time is up, you wait and see.These walls and bars won't keep that stuff from me.***No, no, baby,Won't keep that stuff from me.No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no.No, no, no, no, no, no, no.***I need you right now mama.I need you right now baby.Right by my side, honey.All night long.***Make me feel alright ...Yes, all ..., yes, all ..., yes, all ... alright.***You better come on up and get down with me.I'll make you feel real good, just you wait and see.
***Make me feel alright ..., yes, I feel alright ...Yes, all ..., yes, all ..., yes, alright.http://www.lyricsdownload.com/grand-funk-railroad-inside-looking-out-lyrics.html

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Comment #13 posted by runderwo on March 26, 2006 at 12:53:14 PT

sigh
"A person under the influence of pot is an impaired driver."Not according to several studies over 20 years: http://www.cannabisculture.com/articles/4131.html"Ask someone who has lost a family member to a drug-impaired driver if the police should fight more violent and serious crimes than this?"I thought we were talking about cannabis. Now it's "Drug-impaired". Quit changing the subject."Ask a kid who has lost her mom to drugs and who is living in a foster home what a violent and serious crime is."Has anyone ever lost a mom to cannabis? Aside from the state taking the child away, that is. But that's the fault of insane prohibition, not cannabis."Ask serious and violent addicts what drug they started out on."I hope you meant what ILLEGAL drug did they first use? Because most often, people are starting out on alcohol, cigarettes and pharms, all demonstrably more harmful than cannabis."Ask the teacher who is trying to teach when there is a kid in class who is sitting there stoned."If the kid suffers impaired learning as a result of being stoned, he is only hurting himself. And the decrim issue is about ADULT cannabis use, stop changing the subject.http://www.ukiahdailyjournal.com/Stories/0,1413,91~3089~3274484,00.html"Ask the family members who go to Narc-Anon if pot is all that nonserious and nonviolent in its effects."Actually, if you ask Narc-Anon about ANY drug, they will preach about the evils of it, since they are a Scientologist organization driven by a religious agenda."Ask the people who have suffered home invasions by desperate addicts looking for pot, if they did not endure a serious and violent crime."WTF? This lady is nuts. Cannabis does not form physical dependency leading to the "desperation" she so wishes existed."Ask the hikers who have inadvertently stumbled on a pot farm way up in the woods if their lives were not in danger."Only because of prohibition, what other plant is worth more than its weight in gold? But you're claiming an even stricter prohibition will de-associate cannabis from criminal types and organized crime in general?"Still another thought. Since there will always be rapes, shouldn't we just decriminalize rape? Same logic."Rape is a violent crime that infringes the rights of another individual. Pot is a crime only because it has been declared a crime, there is no moral basis whatsoever for pot prohibition. By equating pot with rape, you are TRIVIALIZING rape, you nimrod. And by making the penalties for pot greater than or equal to those for rape, you are undermining people's respect for the law."Let's declare war on decriminalizing dope."Let's declare war on idiocy.
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Comment #12 posted by Hope on March 26, 2006 at 11:11:12 PT

"Out of these stone"ers....I can raise up....
Do you suppose "stoner" was mistranslated to "stones"?:0)Well....they knew that North and South could meet, somehow, and East and West couldn't.
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Comment #11 posted by Hope on March 26, 2006 at 10:50:32 PT

A thought...
What "dangerous cannabis addicts" really do is "invade" their own homes. Under their beds. In their closets.Maybe I put some "here" or "there". They clean closets and drawers. Shake out clothing. Search their own pockets! Shake all their shoes and boots. They wonder and wonder and wonder. That's why most cannabis fans can pretty much be sure they havn't got any laying about the house they've forgotten.Am I right?Just remembering that kind of gives me a fit of Jonesing. It's been ages....but....I wonder....Did I look there? Might I have overlooked it?Hmmmmm.

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Comment #10 posted by Hope on March 26, 2006 at 10:43:15 PT

  JR
That one surprised me. Then it made me laugh."...suffered home invasions by desperate addicts looking for pot.":0)That's just stupid.
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Comment #9 posted by FoM on March 26, 2006 at 10:37:18 PT

JR Bob Dobbs 
Exactly.
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Comment #8 posted by JR Bob Dobbs on March 26, 2006 at 10:31:51 PT

Ummm... this has happened??
>>Ask the people who have suffered home invasions by desperate addicts looking for pot, if they did not endure a serious and violent crime.How often does home invasion by crazed potheads really happen? Have I missed this crime wave on the news? The only pot-related home invasions I can recall happened because the invader was trying to make a quick profit raiding a grow op. They steal it to sell, not to smoke. And if cannabis were legal, the price would drop to the point that raiding someone's garden wouldn't be worth the time and effort.
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Comment #7 posted by FoM on March 26, 2006 at 10:23:19 PT

Rape Versus Pot
Rape is a violation of a person's body and soul. It is pushed upon a person and they can't stop this violation.Pot is different. People don't have joints put in their mouth with their hands tied behind their back and made to smoke it. The comparison is absolutely stupid to a reasoning person.
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Comment #6 posted by Hope on March 26, 2006 at 09:44:46 PT

Lte. to Ed.
Just fired one off. Subject matter..."She's never been raped."
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Comment #5 posted by Hope on March 26, 2006 at 09:34:35 PT

Cannabis again causes insanity in non-user.
"Still another thought. Since there will always be rapes, shouldn't we just decriminalize rape? Same logic. Let's declare war on decriminalizing dope."(At least we can pretty much comprehend that Dear Karol has never been raped.)
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Comment #4 posted by FoM on March 26, 2006 at 09:10:23 PT

If He Hasn't Seen The Pictures
Here they are!http://www.freedomtoexhale.com/eventpics.htm
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Comment #3 posted by Sam Adams on March 26, 2006 at 09:07:42 PT

Attention Mr. (Ms?) Delmar
Uh, didn't you notice the cannabis being handed out on the steps of city hall? If you don't like living in Stoner City, better move, it's a little late to complain now. Perhaps Orange County would be a better choice?
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Comment #2 posted by whig on March 26, 2006 at 08:51:37 PT

A SAFER approach....
Let's look at the other side of the coin.Ok.A person under the influence of pot is an impaired driver.Even if they aren't driving?What is a person under the influence of alcohol? Okay, if they aren't behind the wheel, or if they aren't over the legal limit, they aren't presumed to be impaired, even though alcohol is inherently more impairing than cannabis.But surely you aren't saying alcohol prohibition should be reinstated and prosecuted as the highest priority?Ask someone who has lost a family member to a drug-impaired driver if the police should fight more violent and serious crimes than this?Again, if we're just talking about driving under the influence, then alcohol remains the larger problem.Ask a kid who has lost her mom to drugs and who is living in a foster home what a violent and serious crime is.Alcohol can kill, and it makes some people violent. Prohibition causes violent crime, as well. But cannabis?Ask serious and violent addicts what drug they started out on.I'd lay 20:1 odds, the correct answer is alcohol. Not cannabis.
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Comment #1 posted by FoM on March 26, 2006 at 08:25:37 PT

Not a Stoner City
Santa Cruz is not a Stoner City. Santa Cruz is an example for the rest of the United States. Lord knows we need freedom for the people. What a beautiful thought and Santa Cruz always gives me a sense of real freedom.
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