cannabisnews.com: CNN Transcript: NewsNight with Aaron Brown





CNN Transcript: NewsNight with Aaron Brown
Posted by CN Staff on November 29, 2004 at 22:57:45 PT
Partial Transcript: Supreme Court Takes Up MMJ
Source: CNN 
AARON BROWN, HOST: Good evening, again, everyone.So you believe in freedom. How much freedom do you believe in? Do you believe, for example, that people in the state of Montana should be able to decide that some sick people in that state should smoke pot if they want? Not sell pot to kids, not take it to Wyoming and smoke it. Just sit there in Helena, Montana, and smoke pot.
Eleven states have decided by vote, democracy, that certain ill people should be allowed to use marijuana. They don't make anyone smoke it. They just say if you have certain illnesses, and your doctor agrees, you may smoke it.The federal government went before the U.S. Supreme Court today to argue that the people in those states, people who voted on this, those people don't have that right, that freedom.This isn't really about pot. It isn't, really. It's about freedom. How much do we have, or should we have in a free society, and whether we believe it when we say that the era of big government is over.We'll spend some time on that question tonight.As we mentioned at the top of the program, the U.S. Supreme Court took up the question of medical marijuana today, hearing arguments that could leave intact or invalidate the votes of people in 11 mostly Western states. The court has already ruled against so-called growing clubs. But this case centered more on the individual. What right does the individual have to grow and use marijuana when ill?Covering the court, CNN's Bob Franken.(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)FRANKEN: For Angel Raich, it's not about the sweeping issues her case places before the justices. For her, it's her brain tumor, and what she says is her need for help from marijuana.ANGEL RAICH, MEDICAL MARIJUANA USER: I need to use cannabis every two hours. If I don't medicate every two hours, I become debilitated.ARRAF: Her home state of California is one of 11 that permit private use of marijuana for medical purposes. But federal law prohibits virtually any use.So the Supreme Court was again hearing arguments over the constitutional power of the federal government to override state laws. Was the medical, individual use of home-grown marijuana interstate commerce?Yes, said Paul Clement, the administration's acting solicitor general, because the garden patch weed would affect overall production.Randy Barnett, who argued the other side, called any connection hypothetical, since it's privately grown, not bought or sold. Many argue there's little evidence that marijuana has medical value.UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It's a handful of people who want to see not just marijuana, but all drugs legalized.ARRAF: Inside, the justices peppered both sides. Ginsburg, Nobody is buying anything, nobody is selling anything. But Justice Breyer argued a preference for medicine by regulation as opposed to medicine by referendum.The referendum in these cases involves the nine Supreme Court justices, including, we're told, Chief Justice Rehnquist, who was not present again today, as he fights his own medical afflictions.Bob Franken, CNN, Washington.(END VIDEOTAPE)BROWN: Later in the program, we return to the question of medical marijuana, several facets of the debate, starting with the purely medical. Does pot actually help people feel better? How solid is the research?And beyond medical debate, the culture war. Why has the issue become such a big deal in the country? We'll talk with Dr. Andrew Weil about that.And also, what role, if any, should the FDA play in all of that?BROWN: Coming up on NEWSNIGHT tonight, medicine and marijuana, the medical part of the debate. Does pot actually help sick people? What the science shows.And after that, beyond the medicine to the cultural, the beliefs that shape our views on marijuana and the debate over its use.A break first around the world.This is NEWSNIGHT.(COMMERCIAL BREAK)BROWN: Back now to the debate on medical marijuana. The court argument today centered less on medicine than on economics. A court ruling back in the '40s said that wheat grown for personal use could be regulated by the federal government because it impacted the overall price of wheat at the market, that one person growing wheat in his back yard bought less.If that principle holds, the court will likely strike down state laws that deal with medical marijuana.But what of the science, the claims that it helps some people eat better or feel better in ways that other legal prescription drugs cannot?From Atlanta tonight, CNN medical correspondent Elizabeth Cohen.(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)COHEN (voice-over): Does marijuana really help sick people feel better? Or is it just that they feel better because they're high? Medical researchers have been asking that question for years, and here's what they've come up with. Marijuana has an effect on several centers of the brain. For example, there are receptors to a chemical in marijuana in the hypothalamus, which controls appetite, important for AIDS and cancer patients who are wasting away.DR. GLEN HANSON, UNIVERSITY OF UTAH: Oftentimes, it's hard to get these people to eat. If you stimulate the cannabinoid receptors, then you can bring the appetite back, and they will eat. And obviously that's a good thing.COHEN: There are also cannabinoid receptors in the brainstem, which deals with pain.HANSON: For some types of pain it may reduce that pain.COHEN: But Dr. Hanson, a pharmacologist and senior adviser to the National Institute on Drug Abuse, says there aren't enough good studies to determine whether marijuana is better than other drugs for pain or loss of appetite, other drugs that wouldn't have bad side effects such as decreased blood flow to the brain, memory problems, and infertility. He believes that only rarely is pot the only option.HANSON: Under those cases, almost humanitarian cases, I would say it's better to use the marijuana than to make or allow a patient to suffer.COHEN: The American Medical Association has called for more studies. And in the meantime, many scientists want drug companies to make a medicine with the effects of THC, the chemical that's medically useful in marijuana, without the bad side effects.(END VIDEOTAPE)COHEN: Now, there is a prescription drug called marinol, which is made to have the good affects of marijuana without having any of those bad side effects. But some scientists will tell you that it doesn't get into the body as effectively because it's a pill and not inhaled, Aaron.BROWN: And is that -- the why not -- this will be stupid, I suppose, but why not make marinol in a form that you could inhale it, make it as a mist or something?COHEN: Well, that's exactly what scientists are trying to do. They're trying to make a drug that would mimic the good effects of marijuana and could be inhaled, that wouldn't be a pill. But, you know, that's not easy to do. That's something that they're working on.BROWN: Elizabeth, thank you very much. Elizabeth Cohen in Atlanta tonight.Even though it's illegal, to some doctors medical marijuana falls under the category of alternative medicine. While some people say alternative medicine is the best way to go in looking for a cure, others say it's more in the realm of witch doctors. So are the two ends of this argument.We're joined from Houston -- from Tucson, Arizona, rather, by bestselling author Dr. Andrew Weil.It's nice to see you, sir.You'd agree, I think, that smoking marijuana, for sick people, isn't a perfect way to go. There are downsides to it. Is the argument that it's just better in some respects than anything else that's out there?DR. ANDREW WEIL, AUTHOR: Well, first of all, marijuana is probably the least toxic drug known to medicine. So that alone recommends it for trying to find ways to use it.And for many of these conditions, like stimulating appetite, for example, we really don't have drugs and medicine that work for that condition. And the drugs that we have for many of the other uses that people like marijuana are much more toxic.So that's certainly in favor of marijuana. Obviously, it's not ideal to have patients taking any medication by smoking. There is, by the way, a preparation of whole marijuana being developed in England called Sativex (ph) that's a spray that you spray under the tongue. I think that would make it much more medically respectable and more usable by physicians.BROWN: In a sense, is that what you think needs to happen, that some pharmaceutical company has to come up with some way to make marijuana respectable?WEIL: Yes. Now, I don't think that means, by the way, making the high go away, because the high -- the effect on mood may be a desirable effect, especially for people with terminal illness. I do, however, think that there needs to be some better way of cleanly distinguishing between medical use and recreational use.And at the moment, I think that boundary is very blurred.BROWN: In and of itself, do you believe marijuana is an especially harmful drug?WEIL: No. In purely medical terms, physical terms, I think it's one of the least harmful drugs that we know of, and much less harmful than most drugs used in medicine, and much, much less harmful than the recreational drugs that we have made legal in this country, especially alcohol and tobacco.(CROSSTALK) WEIL: I think the opposition -- go on.BROWN: Yes. I was going to say, why do we -- it's interesting to watch other countries, other cultures deal with this, and often deal with it differently from the way we do. Why do we seem to struggle with it so? WEIL: I think it's because people react to marijuana as a symbol, rather than as a thing in itself. And marijuana in this society has always been associated with deviant subcultures, originally with black jazz musicians in the South, with Mexican migrant labors. Later, with Bohemians, beatniks, then, in the '60s, hippies, radicals, the counterculture. It's always had associations with deviant subcultures. And I think that's what people react to. When you listen to what I call fanatical extremist groups, like the Partnership For a Drug-Free America, that reaction is to that aspect of marijuana, the symbolic aspect of it. BROWN: I think that the Partnership For the Drug-Free America would make an argument -- and it's not a wholly unsupportable argument -- that the last thing the culture needs is one more drug for people to use and abuse. WEIL: And I would also say that the idea of creating a drug-free America is laughable. We have never been a drug-free America. We never will be. We are awash in drugs, both legal and illegal. It's always going to be that way. Of the drugs that people use, marijuana I think is one of the least worrisome in medical terms. And I think it's one that has significant medical potential. It would be absolutely silly for us to reject that medical potential. And I really think it's up to the medical profession to decide whether to use this substance and how to use it. BROWN: Just one more area here. I'm sure you've thought about this. If you go back to the beginning of time, I suspect you would find that in every culture, where they could figure it out, there was some drug, a mushroom, a drink, a plant, whatever, that altered people's feelings. Have you wondered what it is about humans that want that? WEIL: I have. In fact, I wrote a book about that in 1972 called "The Natural Mind" which argues that the desire to alter consciousness is something that is basically human. And I think it's connected with our creativity, our desire to know ourselves. I think there's lots of ways you can do that, by the way, not just with drugs. But drugs are very convenient. BROWN: Nice to talk to you. Thanks for your time tonight. WEIL: Good to talk to you. BROWN: Thank you, Dr. Weil.Complete Transcripts: http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0411/29/asb.01.htmlSource: CNN (US Web) Show: News Night with Aaron BrownShow Date: November 29, 2004Copyright: 2004 Cable News Network, Inc. Website: http://www.cnn.com/ Contact: cnn.feedback cnn.comDL: http://www.cnn.com/CNN/Programs/aaron.brown/Related Articles & Web Sites:Raich vs. Ashcroft http://www.angeljustice.org/Angel Raich v. Ashcroft Newshttp://freedomtoexhale.com/raich.htmMarijuana Paranoiahttp://cannabisnews.com/news/thread19914.shtmlIt's State Law vs. Federal Law in MMJ Casehttp://cannabisnews.com/news/thread19913.shtmlStates' Rights Defense Falters in MMJ Casehttp://cannabisnews.com/news/thread19912.shtml
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Comment #9 posted by dr slider on November 30, 2004 at 11:44:40 PT:
just for pain my a**
I am claiming that cannabis treats my underlying condition of peripheral neuropathy. Why do you think Angel's massage oils got her out of her wheelchair? Why do you think Angel's tumor has leased its grip?This incessant angle that cannabis is purely pallative has got to go!
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Comment #8 posted by dongenero on November 30, 2004 at 07:48:23 PT
snipped:Paula Zahn transcript
ZAHN: So Randy, what about that fear? That if you allow this to happen in every state in America, what you're doing is encouraging recreational users to become addicted to these kinds of drugs.RANDY BARNETT, ATTORNEY FOR MEDICAL MARIJUANA USERS: Recreational use is still illegal under California law. California has made record drug busts for marijuana since the medical cannabis initiative has been enacted. So that's really a false issue here. What your viewers should be paying attention to is the constitutional issues in this case. And one of the things that they should be careful to know is that nothing the Supreme Court decides in this case will invalidate those state laws. Those state laws will remain in effect and they will give some protection to these patients in the ten states -- in the 11 states that have those laws. What this case is about is the limits of federal power to interfere with the operation of those laws by arresting people that California says may do what Angel and my other client Diane Monson (ph) are doing, protecting themselves and avoiding pain and suffering. ZAHN: Calvina, do you think there's no such thing as compassionate use of marijuana? That's what the doctors call it when they don't believe that any other treatment will provide pain relief for their patients.FAY: I don't think it's compassionate to mislead people to use a drug that's been shown to be addictive, harmful, has no medicinal value to it as far as scientific evidence shows, to mislead them and make them think that it's making them better. Like I said when you take a drug you do feel better. That's why people take drugs. But it does not mean that it's treating the condition. And it's allowing that person to go untreated with legitimate medicine that could possibly help them.ZAHN: Randy, do you think these patients are being misled by false hope?BARNETT: Absolutely not. And nobody's claiming that medical cannabis treats the underlying conditions. What medical cannabis largely does is allow patients to survive traditional chemotherapy. For example by allowing them to overcome the nausea that's associated with chemotherapy. It allows them to survive AIDS treatment by allowing them to overcome wasting syndrome. Nobody claims that cannabis itself is a cure. Cannabis makes possible other medications to work. And it also alleviates pain and suffering. I suggest that you take a look at the Institute for Medicines report on the usefulness of medical cannabis. The recommendation was that medical cannabis be available until safer mechanisms for delivering the chemicals that are in marijuana are developed by medical pharmaceutical companies.ZAHN: So do you poke holes in that report, Calvina? You don't subscribe to any of it?FAY: Absolutely, the report clearly says that there is absolutely no future in smoking marijuana as medicine. It does talk about the fact that THC, one of the ingredients in marijuana has medicinal value. And THC is already available in prescription form, FDA approved, marketed under the name of Marinol. That's not something we object to. So the THC is available already. It's FDA approved and prescribed. That's very different than taking a crude weed such as marijuana and smoking it and taking into your lungs, and the respiratory system hundreds of different compounds, many of which have been proven to be cancer-causing.ZAHN: Randy, I see you shaking your head no. What part of that do you disagree with?BARNETT: There are other cannabinoids in smoke marijuana that the Institute for Medicine found to be promising and useful therapeutically. There's no question, it's not just THC. Some people can't take THC. The other thing people don't tell you is that Marinol which has this THC is also intoxicating and that's one of the effects that people don't like when they use Marinol. So what the Institute for Medicine said was we really do need more effective delivery mechanisms. That's why they said there's no future for smoke marijuana. But in the meantime while the government obstructs research into these areas by denying for example sources of medical cannabis for testing purposes, all that patients have left is smoke marijuana and the Institute for Medicines recommends that they be available.ZAHN: Well, you've both given us a lot to think about here this evening. Calvina Fay, Randy Barnett, thank you for both of your perspectives.
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Comment #7 posted by dongenero on November 30, 2004 at 07:42:23 PT
med. marijuana coverage
I love Aaron Brown's introduction to the show. That is great.
Dr. Weil is awesome too. There are some beautiful, succinct points made in this transcript.I also watched Paula Zahn's coverage last night and it was very good. She makes good points and basically calls out the people that are making dubious statements....which of course is primarily the anti crowd. There was a two up debate with some anti cannabis woman and Angel's attorney. The attorney for Angel won the argument handily.Now.....what will the Chief Justices do? All I can say is that if the Supreme Court rules against, it will degrade what respect I have for the Court and prove them to be an easily influenced tool of partisan political/corporate interest, in my mind. There would be no justice in a ruling against. 
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Comment #6 posted by cloud7 on November 30, 2004 at 07:22:23 PT
2 articles
Both from LewRockwell.comCommerce Abusehttp://www.lewrockwell.com/orig4/watkins4.htmlHigh Court Must Take Lead in Medical Marijuana Debate Because Politicians Will Nothttp://www.lewrockwell.com/orig5/armentano-p5.html
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Comment #5 posted by Larry Konkol on November 30, 2004 at 07:12:59 PT:
time warp?
I live in Alaska and the last election found the pot issue almost fifty to fifty. With no mandate either way. I am amazed that I got this old and still can't understand how so many fellow Americans missed the sixties. And how so many "officials" know so little about individuals right to govern themselves.Pot is only part of the overall use of misguided intent to tell us all whats good for us and what isn't. I where in God's name did all the non-pot people live while I was growing up. Maybe all the potheads found reality and all the rest took drugs. 
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Comment #4 posted by goneposthole on November 30, 2004 at 05:40:51 PT
Prozac is a dangerous drug
In the mid nineties, a friend of mine ended his own life. He was prescribed Prozac. Another individual in my community ended the life of another while on Prozac.A coincidence it's not.The maker of Prozac is free to manufacture and distribute this substance with impunity and with the approval and the blessings of the FDA.It's legal, so it must be ok.
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Comment #3 posted by E_Johnson on November 29, 2004 at 23:28:31 PT
Bret Favre's wife is having chemo
Tonight on Monday Night Football they announced that Bret Favre's wife is undergoing chemo and she is telling people that it's far worse than she was prepared for.I'm hoping someone will get her some pot.
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Comment #2 posted by FoM on November 29, 2004 at 23:07:31 PT
Transcript: Paula Zahn Now
Supreme Court Considers Medical Marijuanahttp://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0411/29/pzn.01.html
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Comment #1 posted by FoM on November 29, 2004 at 23:04:40 PT
CNN Poll
Current Results:Should marijuana use be allowed for medical treatment?  
Yes   -- 92% -- 2268 votes  
No   -- 8% -- 191 votes Total: 2459 votes 
 Please Vote: http://www.cnn.com/CNN/Programs/paula.zahn.now/
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