cannabisnews.com: The Eternal Marijuana Debate










  The Eternal Marijuana Debate

Posted by CN Staff on March 16, 2003 at 17:18:58 PT
By Dan Ferguson  
Source: Surrey Leader  

Would legalizing pot eliminate organized crime’s involvement in the booming indoor pot growing industry? Well-known B.C. marijuana activist Marc Emery says yes, while RCMP Staff Sgt. Chuck Doucette, the force’s provincial drug awareness coordinator, says the answer is a better coordinated campaign of law enforcement. Emery predicts decriminalization of marijuana will see pot growers switch to greenhouses. 
“Once it’s legal, you’ll never see a grow op in a house again,” Emery told The Leader. “No one in their right mind would grow indoors in a house – it’s much too expensive.” Doucette disagreed, saying as long as pot is illegal in the U.S., organized crime will be very much involved in smuggling it across the border. “The majority of marijuana grown in Canada goes to the United States,” Doucette estimated. “You can legalize it in Canada all you want, but they (organized crime) will continue to sell it in the States, and the reality is they will (continue to) bring in cocaine and guns and all kinds of illegal paraphernalia (into Canada).” Emery agreed organized crime would still be involved in Canadian pot growing if marijuana remained illegal in the U.S. but it would be limited to cross-border smuggling. “It wouldn’t be our (Canada’s) responsibility,” Emery said. Emery predicted legalizing pot in Canada would force the U.S. to do the same “six months to a year” afterwards. Doucette and Emery were reacting to a recently completed Surrey RCMP Drug Section study that projected there are 3,500 to 4,500 indoor marijuana growing operations in the city, as much as six per cent of the city’s total housing stock. New homes are increasingly popular pot growing sites, with operators preferring to buy rather than rent, the study indicates. Emery, founder and president of the B.C. Marijuana Party, and a former candidate for Vancouver mayor, claimed the trend toward buying instead of renting has been encouraged by Surrey’s low housing prices and the municipality’s recent crackdown on landlords who rent to growers. “You can buy property cheaper in Surrey than you can anywhere else in the Lower Mainland,” Emery said. “There’s a high level of availability.” Emery said his information is that the pot trade in Surrey is dominated by Vietnamese growers, who don’t buy the houses outright, preferring to take out a mortgage. That way, if the house is raided and seized as proceeds of crime, the grower is only out of pocket his down payment and monthly installments, Emery said. “They’ve learned the value of leveraging.” Emery complained police concerns about the potential hazards posed by grow ops have been overblown, saying most are run by people who are determined to keep a low profile. “Those are the best kinds of neighbours,” Emery said. “They’re not harmful. They don’t want to get noticed.” Sgt. Doucette disagreed. “That works really well until the place blows up because they had propane inside and wiring not done by professional electricians.” While not every pot smoker graduates to hard drugs like cocaine and heroin, studies show every hard drug user first started with marijuana, Doucette argued. The key to quelling the booming trade, he says, is a coordinated effort by all levels of government and law enforcement, rather than the piecemeal approach that has been used. “There has never been a war on drugs in Canada,” Doucette commented. “When I think of a war, I think of clearly defined targets. I think of unlimited resources and a coordinated effort ... under the strong leadership of one general. We have none of those in Canada.” Doucette described the City of Surrey’s current crackdown on drug use in Whalley as a “skirmish,” not a true war on drugs. Complete Title: Legalization vs. Enforcement: The Eternal Marijuana DebateSource: Surrey Leader (CN BC)Author: Dan Ferguson Published: March 14, 2003Copyright: 2003 Surrey LeaderContact: newsroom surreyleader.comWebsite: http://www.surreyleader.com/Related Articles & Web Sites:Cannabis Culture Magazinehttp://www.cannabisculture.com/Cannabis News Canadian Linkshttp://freedomtoexhale.com/can.htmSolicitor General To Review MJ Grow Penaltieshttp://cannabisnews.com/news/thread15737.shtmlThe Coming Canadian Drug Revolutionhttp://cannabisnews.com/news/thread15192.shtml

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Comment #11 posted by afterburner on March 17, 2003 at 14:42:49 PT:
Missive for a More Peaceful Time.
"Many of our modern lives are far removed from the natural world. Many of our modern lives are far removed from beauty and from elegance, and from the idea that beauty can be a mirror or a gateway to God.Skyscrapers dominate our modern cities. The grandeur and glory of God is lost amid urban chaos and cacaphony. Earthly beauty is often strewn with litter and marred by graffiti. When community life centered on the church, temple, or synagogue, it was a privilege to craft altar cloths, cultivate and gather fresh flowers, light tapering candles and incense. These aesthetic delights were considered to raise consciousness that we might better approach the Almighty.It can be difficult to maintain a transcendent thought on the streets of our cities. 'Curb you dog' can also curb your thoughts. We may hurry on our way, watching the inner movie, but we seldom turn the camera of consciousness onto beauty.All of life, every scrap and morsel, is sacred, creative, and charged with meaning. There is beauty in a tiny embroidered handkerchief, beauty in the sweeping span of a bridge. There is beauty in what God has made and beauty in what man has made. And making beauty makes God manifest.'The kingdom of heaven is among us,' Christ taught. Blake believed that if the doors of perception were flung open, we would be dazzled by beauty everywhere. It is not reserved for museums or concert halls. It is in the kitchen and in the clinic, the hospice and the hospital. Just as there is no subject that cannot be addressed by art, there is no aspect of living off limits to our creativity or to our own creator. The awakened eye sees art everywhere. The awakened ear hears music in the drip of a faucet, the scrape of a chair, the squeal of a brake. Holy, holy, holy, Catholics explain, bowing to the beauty of the Host raised on high. The mountains of Tibet, the thundering falls of Niagara, evoke the same startled shout of the soul, at once humbled and exalted. The exquisite statuary of the Orient exudes a powerful sense of the sacred even when yanked from its moorings and deposited in the sterile space of a museum. It is a circular proposition: The beautiful creates a sense of the sacred, the sacred demands we create the beautiful." -Julia Cameron, God Is No Laughing Matter.May you find a quiet space away from the War on Iraq / the War on Some Plants to hear the still small voice, to see the creator's handiwork.ego destruction or ego transcendence, that is the question.
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Comment #10 posted by FoM on March 17, 2003 at 13:34:34 PT
TecHnoCult
I want to say that I'm not sure. I haven't followed the peace movement very closely. I've kept up with World Link TV watching the anti war protests but maybe someone else can answer your question. I wasn't aware of a peace movement other then the anti war one. 
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Comment #9 posted by TecHnoCult on March 17, 2003 at 13:22:03 PT
Peace Movement
I was less referring to the peace movement, but more to the overall movement. Perhaps my interpratation of history is fuzzy, but I always thought of the peace movements and civil rights movements of the 60s/70s as being related. Does anyone agree?THC
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Comment #8 posted by FoM on March 17, 2003 at 07:42:24 PT
TecHnoCult
I didn't say anything about the peace movement. Will it lose it's strength? It might for a little while because war is very sobering and stops everyone in their tracks. As the bombings progress and if Hussein is killed the war could end and the peace movement right along with it. It depends on what Hussein does and how we respond that will determine the future for the peace movement. I actually feel relief because it now is out of our hands and the responsibility rests on George Bush, Tony Blair and the United Nations. Only history will tell us if this was right or wrong in my opinion.
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Comment #7 posted by FoM on March 17, 2003 at 07:31:43 PT
TecHnoCult
We will start bombing in a few days now that there won't be a vote from the United Nations. I was too young to remember the beginning of Vietnam but I remember it well in the late 60s. We only found out days after something happened because TV wasn't like it is currently. We have International News Channels and CNN, MSNBC and FoxNews. I know that Saddam Hussein is a very bad person and he should be removed but will they get him or just kill many innocents? I am sad for those who will die but war is hell and it's about to start. 
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Comment #6 posted by TecHnoCult on March 17, 2003 at 07:23:31 PT
Viet Nam
I am too young, I was a child during the Viet Nam days. But, for those of you who have been around for a little longer than me, how does this compare to the early days of Viet Nam? I don't think this will be as drawn out, so I am not really referring to the conflict itself, but to the peace movement, etc. Do you feel there may be a catalyst to another big movement like Viet Nam was?THC
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Comment #5 posted by freedom fighter on March 16, 2003 at 23:59:33 PT
I shall stand by you
my friend, lehder, in a huge chessboard, I find myself dressed like a white pawn... Looking across the field, I see my friend Lehder all dressed in black.. as a pawn.. You smiled! I smiled! Here comes the Revolution!!May all the decent common folks win this time...peaceff
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Comment #4 posted by FoM on March 16, 2003 at 20:54:21 PT
Lehder 
How beautiful. Your Mother sounds like she was a remarkable person. She gave you your qualities I'm sure. My husband lost his Father on November 22nd and my husband was with him thru it all including the end. Today I've been alone because my husband is on the road and I have been crying on and off all day. I'm not crying for me but for the world. I am so ashamed to be an American. I once was proud. I watched the protests yesterday on World Link TV and C Span. I thought that loving, caring people weren't around much anywhere anymore but I was wrong. I love mankind not just Americans. I love, Christians, Jews, Muslins and Atheists. I love people for their compassion not their status. I love people for their kindness not their money. War is just days away and then the future will be so different. People who are capable of living in very bad circumstances will be the winners in this all. All the plastic people will be exposed for who they are. A separation is going to happen like we have never seen before. It is very nice to see you.
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Comment #3 posted by Lehder on March 16, 2003 at 20:30:51 PT
Revolucion!
The "marijuana debate", if there ever was one, is not eternal. In fact it is only now about to begin and end in short order. Let us anticipate that the "marijuana debate" will soon become attached to the anti-globalization and peace "debates." (I'm laughing as I write, debate? Has anyone seen any debates lately? Not since Lincoln and Douglas has there been a debate.) But finally, soon, a marijuana debate. Along with a whole lot of other debates. People have accumulated some impressive lists of topics for debate, and the US government is going to be stunned at the depth of their anger. It's going to be stunned right out of its palace. Take a look at this:http://www.balochistanpost.com/item.asp?ID=3430A million, as in Rome and Barcelona before, now march in Pakistan. These people come to the street not only to demand peace, but to bitterly denounce the US. Listen to the fire and vehemence in this oratory: "An attack on Iraq will be considered an attack on Pakistan...We are ready to respect the army if it acts as a national institution [wow, squaring off with the Pakistani army!]..." And this from the same article:"He predicted that the day is not far away when the people will witness the break up of the United States because of the ill-conceived policies of its current leadership."Could it be? Could it be that one by one the peoples of the US satellites will mass in the streets and bring their governments down just as one by one the peoples of the Soviet Union demolished the ring of captive dictatorships until finally striking the Kremlin itself?Well, it's about to begin:http://icnewcastle.icnetwork.co.uk/0100news/0200national/page.cfm?objectid=12742421&method=full&siteid=50081Let's see how many show up to demand the resignation of Tony Blair. What else might be on these people's minds? I hope they will not go home too soon. How many would it take in Washington DC? What if ten million show up and, with Blair and Sharon jailed weeks before, just refuse to leave until Bush and Cheney and Rumsfeld and Ashcroft and all of the others and the whole damn Congress and the Supreme Court too all just step down and leave town ( they could be apprehended later, probably in Afghan caves)? Would they be too few? Then thirty million will come. Oh, but what about the police?? Well, the day is coming when police will again battle firemen as they did in New York.The day is coming. There's too much tension and energy stored for innocous release by discussion of pubic hair on a Coke can or by identification of a few more evil-doers. But if Americans need more abuse and a continuing affair with intolerance before acting, then there are 1.2 billion Muslims who are less patient. Washington is history, one way or another. Read it and weep!Maybe when the dust, radioactive or not, has settled we'll find that marijuana is no longer a dangerous narcotic. Maybe it will only be a friendly plant as we've always insisted. I never expected re-legalization could come as 
an isolated issue. But don't blame me, you red necks out there. I was against you all along.My mother and I talked last year about the coming revolution. She said, sadly, that she wished she could see it. She died six months ago, almost to the minute, on Yom Kippur. In the days before, I lifted her from the floor when she called for help, too weak to rise. I held her as she shook and vibrated uncontrollably like a stop sign in a gale, frightened as her body tried to burn the mixture of two poisons that had been needled into her. She never vomited from the chemo, and she only once or twice in all those months very mildly complained - such a strong and beautiful woman, and my friend - but I watched her suffer and gradually accept her fate, a creative, kind, incisive and interesting woman active in thought and deed, fighting, thinking and working to within a day of the end. But she did express a desire to try marijuana, just to see if it could help, and she had a right. I am ashamed, and angry, that I, Lehder, bookish recluse in unfamiliar and very conserfvative terrain here, was unable to obtain it for her. (Likely story, buddy. So sad to hear it.) So I intended to go into the city and test its mean streets - in an earlier year I would have brought it to her on a plane - but she insisted that I not take such risks. She looked like me, thought much like me, but was kinder, cooler and wiser than me. I try to be more like her, remembering her advisements and keeping the promises I made. I will watch this revolution for her, or perhaps with her, and I will not forget any of the things I have learned from this life or am about to see.
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Comment #2 posted by delariand on March 16, 2003 at 18:19:06 PT
Been there, refuted that
While not every pot smoker graduates to hard drugs like cocaine and heroin, studies show every hard drug user first started with marijuana, Doucette argued. Again with the gateway crap? Studies also show every user of marijuana started with alcohol or tobacco, first.
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Comment #1 posted by FoM on March 16, 2003 at 17:28:46 PT

Related Article from The Surrey Leader
Pot Clause Proposed in Real Estate Forms 
By Dan FergusonPublished: March 16, 2003A proposal by the Canadian Canadian Real Estate Association being considered by the local real estate board would require realtors to tell would-be buyers if a house has ever been used for an indoor marijuana grow op or other type of criminal activity. The proposed disclosure clause, to be included in all sales agreements, was circulated to real estate associations across the country this week, including the Fraser Valley Real Estate Board, which represents realtors in Surrey and North Delta. Surrey Mounties estimate as many as 4,500 homes are being used for grow ops in this city. Fraser Valley board president Reg Davies was not available for comment as of The Leader’s press deadline Friday. Bob Linney, manager of communications for the Canadian association, said it’s up to the individual associations to decide whether to adopt the clause. 
The proposal was given a cautious endorsement by RCMP Staff Sgt. Chuck Doucette, coordinator of the force’s B.C. drug awareness program. “Anything that helps people become more aware is a good thing,” Doucette said, stressing that he has not had an opportunity to review the proposal in detail. Surrey Coun. Diane Watts, head of the city’s police, fire and public safety committee, supported the proposal, saying homebuyesr have a right to know whether their purchase has been used for criminal activities. “I think it’s going to help the home purchaser (in Surrey) generally.” Watts said buyers ought to be aware of the potential health hazards posed by former grow ops, including “mould inside the walls and the pesticides that are used – damage can be quite extensive without being visible.” It’s information that police are currently not allowed to disclose because of privacy laws, Watts noted.
 
“There are certain things that need to be advised to the general public.” 
Pot Clause Proposed in Real Estate Forms
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