cannabisnews.com: We're Not in Pot Biz, Ottawa Insists We're Not in Pot Biz, Ottawa Insists Posted by CN Staff on October 19, 2002 at 09:51:02 PT By Ian McDougall, Toronto Sun Source: Toronto Sun Ottawa does not want to become the nation's pot pusher, federal lawyers argued yesterday in Ontario Superior Court. The federal government had a chance to present its side of an application by medical marijuana users that would force the federal government to supply them with pot. Eight people applied in September to the Ontario Superior Court to overturn the Marijuana Medical Access Regulations and the section of the Controlled Drugs and Substances Act that prohibits possession of grass. HOMEGROWN Government lawyer Lara Speirs said the federal government does not supply anyone with drugs and allows approved medical marijuana users to grow marijuana themselves or find someone allowed to grow it on their behalf. Lawyers for the pot smokers had earlier argued the act's regulations are not constitutional because they restrict their access to a safe supply of a drug that they need. They also asked the court for an order that would force Ottawa to dole out research dope it is growing in Manitoba. DIFFICULT Speirs admitted finding approved growers and distributors of medical marijuana is difficult. "It's not a perfect system," she said, adding there was no evidence any of the applicants have tried to contact someone approved to grow pot for them. "There is a regulatory process in place that has been completely ignored by the applicants," she said. "To have marijuana for research is far different from distributing marijuana to the applicants. Health Canada is not providing drugs to anyone." Source: Toronto Sun (CN ON)Author: Ian McDougall, Toronto SunPublished: Saturday, October 19, 2002Copyright: 2002 Canoe Limited PartnershipContact: editor sunpub.comWebsite: http://www.fyitoronto.com/torsun.shtmlRelated Articles & Web Site:Canadian Linkshttp://freedomtoexhale.com/can.htmDon't Throw Out Federal Pot Laws, Lawyer Warnshttp://cannabisnews.com/news/thread14502.shtmlNo Charter Right to Medical Pot, Feds Argue http://cannabisnews.com/news/thread14493.shtml Home Comment Email Register Recent Comments Help Comment #42 posted by FoM on October 21, 2002 at 14:20:46 PT idbsne1 Let's please let this thread die. Thank you. [ Post Comment ] Comment #41 posted by idbsne1 on October 21, 2002 at 14:14:22 PT I respectfully disagree.... This forum is NOT just about changing the laws.I have never before started an "argument", but I feel there is some hypocracy here.THIS FORUM IS ABOUT THE TRUTH. Period.Not changing laws. That has become the emphasis lately, because of the ballot initiatives.We are here to spread the truth... to the antis.....TO OURSELVES.To sit here and say that we should not discuss it is as childish and naive as the Sheeple; lets NOT discuss the ugly TRUTH. The absolute reason for posting this here is that everyone here IS IN SEARCH OF THE TRUTH. Everyone here wants cannabis reform, but at the expense of becoming like the antis?I do not doubt Marc Emery's "good" actions. But they have been with money. And money buys favors. Just look at our political system. I know a few people like Emery... nice to the people they like and control....down right dirty to those that threaten their sham.He's nice by giving you a job, but not when he rapes you in the ass. This is the duality we're speaking of here. You should of seen all the dirty spam he had his cronies say on the internet about the seed banks that were threatening his business. Just ask Gypsy Nirvana or Kloset King about the folks in BC.His seed bank is failing. His "breeders" don't even know what a punnett square is. There are now better genetics elsewhere in the world... and the Canadian Government might legalize.So let's wonder why he wants to become a politician.I have a rule of the thumb we should follow for picking leaders/politicians:If they WANT to become a politician, they are already disqualified. Again, this newsgroup is about the truth. Let's say we find out that Emery or someone else is taking payments from the antis...or something like that. Shouldn't that be relevent to this newsgroup? Of course it is. We think it's relevant if another person takes payments or does favors.Just because he's "on our side" doesn't mean we should blindly follow him or support him. That Hitler comment zoomed right over some of us.....idbsne1 [ Post Comment ] Comment #40 posted by FoM on October 21, 2002 at 09:57:03 PT herbdoc215 Thank you again. I appreciate your helping me out with this. I don't like arguing. I avoid it because it upsets me and my life is way to complicated to handle much more then I am handling right now. [ Post Comment ] Comment #39 posted by herbdoc215 on October 21, 2002 at 09:54:01 PT FoM, there are NO other places to talk about this! On all of their forums ANY dissent is moderated out immediately but your right about this not being place to do it as this is your forum. Peace, steve tuck or Mud [ Post Comment ] Comment #38 posted by FoM on October 21, 2002 at 09:53:14 PT herbdoc215 Thank You! You know I wish you the very best. [ Post Comment ] Comment #37 posted by herbdoc215 on October 21, 2002 at 09:51:18 PT I can't type for shit Bad, not bed. shows were I should be though. steve [ Post Comment ] Comment #36 posted by BGreen on October 21, 2002 at 09:51:15 PT Just because I read it doesn't mean I believe it I still wish you all the best, Steven.Bud Green [ Post Comment ] Comment #35 posted by FoM on October 21, 2002 at 09:50:49 PT druid Talkiing about our opposition in the drug war is fine but talking about people that are involved in the reform movement shouldn't be done. That's just not nice. I don't want issues brought here that can be talked about in other places because this is a News forum not a general topic forum. It has nothing to do with changing laws. I don't know why that is hard to understand. Have I failed so completely that that hasn't been made clear? I sure hope not. I don't tell other sites how to do what they do and I ask for the same respect to be returned to C News. [ Post Comment ] Comment #34 posted by herbdoc215 on October 21, 2002 at 09:47:01 PT I am dropping the subject so it should be that! I wish to ask everyone to just let it all go as it's not worth this and I never was trying to get shit started only a discussion. I have defended Marc as much as anybody and still care greatly for him so this wasn't the proper place for this and I am sorry I ever brought it up. It's this duality that has me so upset for I have big feelings for his whole crew and I am sure I have also made many mistakes. BGreen is right as I too have heard bed shit about me and I unaware of what I did to make people feel that way but I wish i could change it. It always easy to mistake anothers motives. I knew as soon as I hit send the other nite I had screwed up but in my anger I guess I tried to hurt them as much as they have hurt me and should never have aired this crap in public as it just makes me look stupidier than I already do. I never meant I wouldn't post here ever again, I just can't discuss this stuff now without a rage coming over me about the needless stuff that has happened here. I appoligise, Peace, Steven Tuck [ Post Comment ] Comment #33 posted by druid on October 21, 2002 at 09:38:36 PT: idbsne1 hit it on the mark I have been posting here on CNews for a while and lurking and just reading for even longer. I understand that sometimes people(myself included) have made personal comments about something that have offended others. I don't find anything wrong with this. This is a forum of Free Speech. If we limit what is said then we are no better than the prohibitionists. Everyone has a right to speak their mind and for the most part everyone here has pretty much the same views and oppinions on things so it's usually all good but there are those times that someone says something personal that someone else disagrees with it. This will not stop for it's human nature to form your own opinion on a subject or just not like someone just because you don't like them. FOM-- Speaking badly about others isn't the spirit of this forum.Of course no one here wants to speak badly of others but as IDBSNE1 said "We badmouth the antis and the Bush Regime ALL THE TIME.Yet would you let me praise the devil without a problem? Or praise John Ashcroft or John Walters and Asa Hutchinson?"We DO badmouth the antis all the time. When has anyone here ever had a nice thing to say about Bush, Walters, Ashcroft, Hutchinson, the DEA, the ONDCP,the FDA, or the insertwhatevernameoragencythatarenotreformersoractivists. Herbdoc made a comment about catching Marc Emery doing something he felt was wrong and Richard Lake asked for Proof so Herbdoc provided the proof. What is wrong with that?Are we no longer a forum of debate and free speech? Am I supposed to just be a CNews sheeple or am I allowed to still form my own opinions and share those opinions with others?I feel it's part of the learning process. If I form an opinion about someone or something and it is wrong I want to know it is wrong and WHY it is wrong. If I am not wrong and I am the one person that sees the truth in something then maybe just maybe I can get that truth out to others. JUST LIKE WE HERE AT CNEWS ARE TRYING TO DO FOR CANNABIS.IDBSNE1--I DO SEE the big picture.... because I have been here with all of you... reading the news everyday. I agree that infighting is not good....but for christ's sake... there ARE evil people in OUR movement as well and we are poised for failure if we do not confront this problem.My sentiments exactly. [ Post Comment ] Comment #32 posted by FoM on October 21, 2002 at 07:29:06 PT Just a Comment I haven't heard anything about all of this because I don't go anywhere but C News and look for news and I really don't want to know since it doesn't have anything to do with changing laws. Steve is welcome to post here if he wants too. If he doesn't that's fine too. Speaking badly about others isn't the spirit of this forum. [ Post Comment ] Comment #31 posted by BGreen on October 21, 2002 at 06:00:16 PT I've read some pretty bad things about Steven Tuck but it's only third-hand information and it has no place being repeated here.Let's drop this slanderous talk. I don't know or care if it's true, but FoM has said (and I believe) this ISN'T THE PLACE FOR IT. [ Post Comment ] Comment #30 posted by lookinside on October 21, 2002 at 05:15:11 PT Steve has seen the horrors... He's suffered the pain.Money corrupts.Emery will go broke if Cannabis is legalized.Wake up and smell the coffee, folks. [ Post Comment ] Comment #29 posted by idbsne1 on October 21, 2002 at 01:00:48 PT Think about it.....? Our movement supports Emery like the prohibitionists support Bush.With complete blindness. Do we really have to know the news on a macro scale? That is exactly what the Feds do... hide the truth on a macro scale.I am not being confrontational FoM, but to say that praise is good; that you will print praise, but not any badmouthing is hypocritical.We badmouth the antis and the Bush Regime ALL THE TIME.Yet would you let me praise the devil without a problem? Or praise John Ashcroft or John Walters and Asa Hutchinson?Our praise for Emery is blind.I am and have been a frequent user of this newsgroup and seed buyers/growers newsgroups and Marc Emery's arrogance is famous there. To hear of the truths that are happening only confirms his previous actions.Hell....just the fact that Steve is in the position he is in should be MORE THAN ENOUGH TRUTH.Tomorrow Steve goes to court without a lawyer to find out whether he gets some time to leave Canada, in which case he can ONLY come back to the States, where the authorities might pick him up; or he will be GIVEN to the authorities. Either way jail time looks possible, where he will die without cannabis. This is why he will not post here anymore....with a ?I DO SEE the big picture.... because I have been here with all of you... reading the news everyday. I agree that infighting is not good....but for christ's sake... there ARE evil people in OUR movement as well and we are poised for failure if we do not confront this problem.I'm sure they thought Hitler was a fine individual too...he was on their side.idbsne1 [ Post Comment ] Comment #28 posted by afterburner on October 20, 2002 at 20:46:10 PT: Thanks, canaman, FoM, The GCW, Dana I've been looking for that Quicksilver Messenger Service song for a long time. It tells it like it is, and like it will be.Peace all.Keep the faith. [ Post Comment ] Comment #27 posted by DANA on October 20, 2002 at 19:22:21 PT ..JAH is no Secret.. ...Exodus...Movement of JAH People!......well said Afterburner...GCW...Canaman......Quicksilver!.....you must have been born around 1956? [ Post Comment ] Comment #26 posted by canaman on October 20, 2002 at 18:27:56 PT The song remains the same.... You poison my sweet water..You cut down my green trees..The food you fed my children was the cause of their disease..My world is slowly falling down and the airs not good to breath..And those of us who care enough we've got to do something..Oh oh what you gonna do about me..Oh oh what you gonna do about me ..Your newspapers they just put you on..They never tell you the whole story..They just put your young ideas down..I was wondering could this be the end of their planet only..Oh oh what you gonna do about me..Oh oh what you gonna do about me...I work in your factory.. I study in your schools..I fill your penetentaries and your military too..And I feel the future trembling as the word gets passed around..If you stand up for what you do believe..Be prepared to be shot down..Oh oh what you gonna do about me..Oh oh what you gonna do about me ..And I feel like a stranger in the land where I was born.. And I live like an outlaw..And I'm always on the run.. And I'm always getting busted..And I've got to take a stand..I believe the revolution must be mighty close at hand..Oh oh what you gonna do about me..Oh oh what you gonna do about me..I smoke marijuana but I can't get behind your walls..And most of what I do believe is against most of your laws..And they build you to injustice but I'm going to be free..Cause your rules and regulations they don't mean a thing to me..Oh oh what you gonna do about me..Oh oh what you gonna do about me..And I feel like a stranger in the land where I was born..And I live like an outlaw I'm always on the run..And though you may be stronger now my time will come around..You keep adding to my numbers as you shoot my people down..Oh oh what you gonna do about me..Oh oh what you gonna do about me..Oh oh what you gonna do about me..........Written By: Jesse Oris Farrow-------- Sung By: Quicksilver Messenger Service (1970) [ Post Comment ] Comment #25 posted by The GCW on October 20, 2002 at 18:09:24 PT afterburner - NOAH? Genisis 9:3, http://bible.gospelcom.net/bible?passage=GEN%2B9&showfn=on&showxref=on&language=english&version=NASB&x=13&y=9 3 "Every moving thing that is alive shall be food for you; I give all to you, as I gave the green plant. NASB3 "Every moving thing that is alive shall be food for you; I give all to you, as I gave the green plant. NIV3 Every moving thing that liveth shall be meat for you; even as the green herb have I given you all things. KJVReference to the very 1st page. [ Post Comment ] Comment #24 posted by FoM on October 20, 2002 at 17:57:39 PT afterburner You're right. Your comment was very nice. With the Initiatives coming up so soon the tension is high. I believe many people are frustrated because we shouldn't even need CNews. It just shouldn't be necessary. At least that's how I feel. Weariness can come right before a big event and Question 9 is a big event. All the issues are important but Nevada is special because it is the first time any real form of legalization is being dealt with. This really is a big event. We are a great community of people. We are different but everyone adds something special. I guess in a way we all are sharing a very important time in history and it is hard to comprehend. [ Post Comment ] Comment #23 posted by afterburner on October 20, 2002 at 17:23:24 PT: Love to All. Fear.pain.sadness.rage.It takes a worried man to sing a worried song. It takes a worried man to sing a worried song. It takes a worried man to sing a worried song. I'm worried now, but I won't be worried long. I've been feeling a lot of pain lately at CN. This is part of the medical marijuana need. People are getting afraid of all the resistance of the federal government(s?). Yes, the stress is high, the need is great, the controlling personalities are rabid with rage. Why would we not feel threatened after all these years? Give thanks and praises to the most high. Give thanks and praises so high. He will not decieve us, my brother. He will only lead us, again. So, take that veil from off of your eyes. Look into the future and realize. Noah had three sons: Ham, Shem, and Japeth, and in Ham was known to be the prophet. Glory to Jah, the prophet has come. Through all these changes. Glory to Jah, the prophet has come. Through all these stages. No woman, no cry. That's what we're here for: to support each other. God is Love. Movement of Jah people. [ Post Comment ] Comment #22 posted by FoM on October 20, 2002 at 16:24:59 PT The GCW That is an interesting article. Boy it is hard being a pacifist but that's my way. I wish him the best. [ Post Comment ] Comment #21 posted by The GCW on October 20, 2002 at 16:14:01 PT Perfect timing... Marc Emery, Canada's Prince of Pot by Dana Larsen (20 Oct, 2002) Four million pot seeds and eight years of tireless activism in support of the marijuana movement.http://www.hempbc.com/articles/2644.html [ Post Comment ] Comment #20 posted by FoM on October 20, 2002 at 10:57:35 PT herbdoc215 I know that the shadow industry isn't perfect. Nothing that is illegal can work without problems. That is why I want to see change and work hard towards that goal. We are a community of people that have one thing in common but after that we all are different and relate to life in our own way. We can't win this war against this plant if we look too closely at the immediate situation. When we broaden our thinking we see that each one of us is only a tiny little piece of the puzzle. When we stand back and look we see the big picture. The big picture is what will bring change so I keep my eyes on that mark. I try not to allow my personal feelings about the plant in general to occupy my mind. It's the Cannabis plant that needs liberated. I hope this helps explain how I look at this very big and very important issue. [ Post Comment ] Comment #19 posted by herbdoc215 on October 20, 2002 at 02:16:59 PT fom, just mod this whole diatribe out if u want... i can't discuss this rationally because of length and complexity, so i'll just leave it be. I must take a very long break from all this before I do or say something I will regret. But this has nothing to do with money or business and everything to do with honor. I cannot maintain a facade of dispassionate objectivity as I guess I have 'went native' in my dealings with the forgotten of our population and can only see things from the micro as it seems after so many Quixotic Initiatives and zero follow-thru the macro has abandoned us. I jst didn't want to seem petty when this is about many more people than me and I see and hear them everyday, it's just not many have keyboards or net connections or courage to stand up to the machine. Physical violence has even been perpetrated against me here as a part of this campaign so I am not quite so flipant as others about all this. It's not me who was worried about my 16 pieces of silver and I care not what is thought about me as I make my own living and buy my own pot and never had or will depend upon a button for my living or beg patients. I just want out of all this controversy and should learn to keep my opinions to myself as I will try very hard to do in the future. I value the friends I have met here as much as any I have ever met and think it's only by real people knowing the full truth we can overcome all these years of forced shame.peace, steve [ Post Comment ] Comment #18 posted by DANA on October 19, 2002 at 23:28:38 PT ..Herbdoc215.... ...Please...reconsider your 'I'll not post here again', thing......I think I know the feeling of being offended by certain responses to postings......Please take another look,,,and remember;,,we are on the same side...We all will say wrong of offensive things sometimes,,but dont condemn all of what we have here because of one thing........I'm sure that I am not alone in saying that your comments,and presence here is highly valued....Sincerely.....d(ddd) [ Post Comment ] Comment #17 posted by FoM on October 19, 2002 at 23:07:27 PT herbdoc215 I hope you understand that I have no idea what Marc Emery does or doesn't do. Cannabis is illegal even in Canada and all I want is to change the laws and let the politics of the business end be in others hands. I'm not interested in who makes what. I want sick people to have Cannabis if they want it. That's as far as my mind can go until the time when the laws are changed. I don't mind people praising anyone they wish because praising is good. Praising helps bring a good feeling to a person when they read they were praised but saying things that are negative only hurts. It can hurt the person or friends of the person and then that causes pain and then fighting and then division. I don't want to give the antis that much because I believe we are better then that. Antis want to see in fighting. They want and hope we can destroy ourselves because they don't have much to stand on anymore. Peace is the way. Forgiveness, even when a person doesn't ask for it, is good. It's good for everyone especially the person who can let it go. I'm speaking from experience so I do know what I'm talking about. [ Post Comment ] Comment #16 posted by BGreen on October 19, 2002 at 23:05:02 PT I'm praying for you, Steven Go into court with a good attitude and showing respect even though these people don't deserve it. Walk with your head held high because you have truth on your side.Tell your story, make your points, tell the judge your fears and how helpless you feel for not being allowed an attorney.Don't give up! It's NOT over 'til it's over. Miracles DO happen, even to cannabis users.God bless you, Steven Tuck. [ Post Comment ] Comment #15 posted by herbdoc215 on October 19, 2002 at 22:57:19 PT enough said, I'll not post here again? Just thought everyone would want to know the truth before I was carted off. I wouldn't be so bitter but after being invited up here and all thats transpired since I feel as betrayed as anybody who ever lived. I have never seen anybody censored here for praising him, and I am really starting to see how stuff works in this business. I am also very hurt and upset how so many can act like compassion is contained in breast, because everytime a woman gets busted or is in news everybody just breaks their neck helping them out BUT if it's a man then he's on his own. I am not wanting to take anything away from the ladies but it just seems as if there is two standards. I also am aware that many here see me as a fanatic but I just have a much better perspective and I see us keep going in circles because we as a movement always run from confrontation even when it's desperately needed. My only regret is not seeing these truths while i still had a family and a life. steven tuck [ Post Comment ] Comment #14 posted by FoM on October 19, 2002 at 22:28:08 PT herbdoc215 I really don't want this to be a place to air issues that aren't of interest to reforming laws. I don't care about what Marc Emery does. It isn't something that concerns news and reform. I don't like hearing anyone talking badly about anyone. You should know that by now. Doesn't Marc Emery have a board that you can talk about issues like yours? Please just not here. I really would appreciate it. Thanks. [ Post Comment ] Comment #13 posted by herbdoc215 on October 19, 2002 at 22:17:17 PT Here you go big boy,,,, Here you go, Robert Ammon Green (owner of Irish Rose Seed Company and another Marc Emery lickspittle) and me was in business together and he had a screwed up crop and it was crap, so he took it to Marc and he paid him 1200.00 Canadian a pound. This was when I was helping Lisa Kirkman and others with planning/opening the club, she bought/got fronted from Marc directly the SAME weed for 2500.00 a pound. Now you got me too air all this laundry out at least you could do is quit judging this from Michigan cause your mad because your gravy train is getting called out for what he is. I didn't start this crap with Marc and I took as much shit as I could before I called it for what it was. But Marc got me out on bond so if you think I would make these statements lightly then you been kissing ass so long your O2 is gone. I have done enough for movement not to have to take your shit while your safe at your keyboard in your own home. Ask many REAL activist how I've been done if you want a dose of reality. I don't have to do anything as Marc is going to show himself for what he is eventually. Peace, Steven Tuck in exile [ Post Comment ] Comment #12 posted by FoM on October 19, 2002 at 19:52:15 PT Richard Thanks for posting what Matt believes. It helps me to understand. I know then when I finally think a decision in the states is final an appeal is filed. Lawyers and politicans are good at splitting words. You know it depends on what is, is. I guess we will be finding out more real soon. [ Post Comment ] Comment #11 posted by Richard Lake on October 19, 2002 at 19:16:48 PT: *smile* - it is not easy to understand, for sure I consider Matt a real expert, living there, with a lot of contacts and background. Here is what he wrote for the DrugSense Weekly a few weeks back:WHAT'S UP IN CANADA, EH?: I confess, I was caught off guard by the Special Senate Committee on Illegal Drugs Report (1). Don't get me wrong. I knew the report was coming. I had been looking forward to it since the Committee was founded in 2000 to study all aspects of illicit drug policy and then reconvened in 2001 with the narrower mandate of considering just cannabis policy "in context."Nor, based on my own reading of the evidence the committee reviewed and heard from such witnesses as Gov. Gary Johnson, Ethan Nadelmann and Dr. John Morgan, was I surprised that the Committee made the enlightened recommendations they did. That the evidence and the experts were crying out for legalization seemed as painfully obvious as it always has. Still, on the eve of the report's release, I confidently predicted that the Committee would recommend decriminalization, or perhaps legalized personal cultivation and possession.I had covered the work of previous parliamentary committees for Cannabis Culture Magazine (2). These committees are struck up whenever Parliament needs to back burner a politically sensitive issue. Most recently, an Advisory Committee on Medicinal Marijuana Regulations is being formed to ease the discomfort of our health minister. Legislators can procrastinate as long as some study or other is in the works; as long as the jury remains out. If they can stall long enough, then our courts are forced to deal with the problem and suffer both the domestic and international heat. What I failed to take into consideration is that our senators, like the judges who struck down our medicinal cannabis laws, are appointed, not elected, and are therefore not as vulnerable to pressure from Canadian and American prohibitionists. The Senate Committee were able to make recommendations based on science and outcomes, not sending symbolic messages to teens and American drug warriors.Not so Parliament's back-up House of Commons Committee on Non-Medical Use of Drugs (3), due to release their findings this November. I expect their report will redeem my pessimistic powers of precognition. In fact, they seem to have already made up their minds. MP Paddy Torsney, chair of the 15-member committee, said there is "no possibility it will recommend legalization of pot." Vice-chair Randy White added, "The general consensus is that legalization is not the route to follow."Canadian prohibitionists were also quick to condemn the report, perhaps too quick. For example, the Canadian Police Association, a trade union representing over 50 municipal police boards and commissions across Canada, held a press conference a scant four hours after the Committee released their report. Four hours is about how long it takes to send a fax from Ottawa to Washington and receive a reply, not how long it takes to carefully analyze a 600 plus page report that was two years in the making.However, as touched on above, this political hot potato will be making its way to the Supreme Court of Canada this December. (4) The Court has agreed to entertain J.S. Mill's argument that "The State has no business or interest or authority to proscribe private conduct that does not involve harm or a definite risk of harm to another individual or other individuals or to society as a whole." Mill defined a "harm threshold", a degree of harm that must be exceeded before the deprivation of liberty inherent in criminal sanctions can be justified. We aren't talking about the right to get high, but rather, the right not to be criminalized for engaging in relatively harmless conduct. If the Court concludes that responsible cannabis use by consenting adults exceeds the "harm threshold," then they will establish it so low that fast food will rise above it. What makes the constitutional challenge the most significant of these three northern developments is that our Charter of Rights and Freedoms, on which the challenge is based, only came into effect in 1982. A mere fortnight on the legal timescale. This will be the first time that our Supreme Court has put the ghosts of Harry Anslinger and Emily Murphy on the stand, and now the judges will have the new Senate Committee report at their elbows.What does all this mean to our American cousins? The U.S. media has been doing a remarkable job of ignoring it, but according to Canadian press accounts, American warriors are staying the course. (5) Last July, when our Justice Minister timidly hinted at the idea of studying the concept of decriminalization, DEA Administrator Asa Hutchinson responded, "We have great respect for Canada and Britain as well, and if they start shifting policies with regards to marijuana it simply increases the rumblings in this country that we ought to re-examine our policy. It is a distraction from a firm policy on drug use." (6)I hate to say it, but Hutchinson is right. Unlike the Netherlands, Canada is too close, both geographically and culturally, to dismiss. Unlike Colombia, we are too white to fumigate, arm and/or invade. Of course, if the DEA were confident that cannabis law reform invariably leads to ruin, then you would expect them to welcome our proving their hypothesis.So, at a minimum, the Senate Committee's unequivocal call for legalization should make lesser reforms, such as decriminalization, more palatable. It should increase "rumblings" in the U.S. that they too should re-examine their policy (note to MAP letter writers). Finally, I pray it distracts the DEA from their senseless raids on compassion clubs and illegal interference with ballot initiatives. Matthew M. Elrod, Metchosin, B.C., http://www.drugsense.org/me/ 1) Special Committee on Illegal Drugs, http://www.parl.gc.ca/illegal-drugs.asp2) Canada's Farce of a Drug Policy Review Continues, http://www.cannabisculture.com/backissues/cc08/oppression/fallacy.html 3) Special Committee on Non-Medical Use of Drugs, http://www.parl.gc.ca/InfoCom/CommitteeMain.asp?Language=E&CommitteeID=217&Joint=0 4) Canada: Top Court Challenge In Works http://www.mapinc.org/drugnews/v02/n1657/a08.html5) War On Drugs Is Still On, U.S. Insists, http://www.mapinc.org/cancom/321A10D3-69E8-4D45-9FBD-A2222C7A1C2B 6) Let's Just Say No To The Drug War http://www.mapinc.org/drugnews/v02/n1351/a02.html [ Post Comment ] Comment #10 posted by FoM on October 19, 2002 at 18:51:30 PT Richard I think I understand. I remember something about life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness being an issue. Many people who are very sick couldn't grow their own and they haven't supplied those that are very sick with a safe and inexpensive means to Cannabis. I guess I thought that the Flin Flon Mine was suppose to be the answer for those who couldn't possibly grow their own. I don't know if that's right or not but I think it seems right. [ Post Comment ] Comment #9 posted by Richard Lake on October 19, 2002 at 18:36:51 PT: Of course. That is why they are in court now. Health Canada believes that they have done exactly what the court asked for. Made it possible for patients to submit appropriate paperwork for approval to use cannabis, and to even grow it, or have someone else grow it for them.But the patients contend that that a near impossible burden has been placed on them that makes the Health Canada approval system a sham.Will the court say that the law is struck down? Non-lawyers would like to believe that, but there is only a very small chance of that.The result we can hope for is that the court will order Health Canada to fix their system in some specific ways, and give them a deadline. In that case Health Canada can say they will change the rules and we will see what they do - or they can say they will not and appeal to the Canadian Supreme Court.On the other hand the court could say that Health Canada has established reasonable rules; i.e. we do not win. Could our side appeal? Sure.However, it seems unlikely that any appeal would be before the Canadian Supreme Court before the cases below. Those cases bring the best chance of real change thru the courts.Richard [ Post Comment ] Comment #8 posted by FoM on October 19, 2002 at 18:21:12 PT Wolfgang Maybe this one? I get all these cases mixed up. They haven't done what they were suppose to do so shouldn't the laws be changed?Court Strikes Down Marijuana Possession Law July 31, 2000 Ontario's top court has struck down the law making marijuana possession a crime. In a long-awaited set of rulings, the Ontario Court of Appeal said Monday that the law is unconstitutional because it fails to take into account the needs of sick and dying Canadians who use the drug as medicine. But the law will remain on the books for another 12 months, during which time Parliament will have the option of rewriting the law. http://cannabisnews.com/news/thread6577.shtml [ Post Comment ] Comment #7 posted by FoM on October 19, 2002 at 18:14:43 PT Wolfgang Is this what you are looking for?Law Against Marijuana Struck Down in Ontario August 01, 2000 Amend statute or face legalization, Ottawa told Ontario's highest court has declared the law prohibiting the possession of marijuana unconstitutional, and has given Ottawa a year to amend it or lose it. The Ontario Court of Appeal said the year is to give Parliament a chance to fill the void. Meanwhile, marijuana possession is still illegal. The court ruled yesterday that the law fails to recognize that marijuana can be used for medicinal purposes by the chronically ill. http://www.cannabisnews.com/news/thread6581.shtml [ Post Comment ] Comment #6 posted by WolfgangWylde on October 19, 2002 at 17:45:51 PT Just to clarity... ... I was referring to the Onatrio Court of Appeals decision of last year, strking down all marijuana laws, but staying said order to give the government one year to make medical marijuana available to all who need it. [ Post Comment ] Comment #5 posted by Richard Lake on October 19, 2002 at 16:58:19 PT: Reality checks The Canadian Supreme Court has not ruled on cannabis, medical or otherwise. However, in Deecember they will hear three cases combined that focus primarly on social or recreational use. See:http://www.cannabislink.ca/legal/index.htmThe ad hominem attack on Marc Emery is totally unsubstantiated. What clubs? What people? Name names. Put up or shut up!Logic tells me that if the clubs paid twice the price, then they also had the money to buy on the street at half the price.Knowing personally most of the club owners I know they are capable of buying where they need to, and wouldn't pay anybody twice the going street price. Get real!Marc is one of a dozen individuals who gives substantially to cannabis law reform efforts, to support court cases, etc.While he has not given directly to the organization I work with, he has given huge amounts to efforts I support.Rather than bashing Marc Emery who gives what he earns back to the community I suggest we do business with him as we can.Richard [ Post Comment ] Comment #4 posted by The GCW on October 19, 2002 at 15:48:47 PT NOW CLASS. Med-pot 101 - Brian Taylor offers unusual course in BC college tour. http://www.hempbc.com/articles/2494.html [ Post Comment ] Comment #3 posted by herbdoc215 on October 19, 2002 at 11:28:45 PT They sure promised me opposite when I gave seeds I don't understand how a gov't can do a 180 degree turn like this? It's all so twisted now that I don't believe this will ever see the light of day or the first patients hands. Anybody who thinks this new decrim bill is a step forward either hasn't read it, bumbed their head or is making a shit-pot of money off the status quo. Like when we caught Marc Emery doing last year, buying pot off street cause he's the only one with any cash on Sunshine Coast and then selling it back to clubs at DOUBLE the price. There is just very little understanding here of how bad or why we need this medicine. Like our club getting busted while 18 year old kids were sitting in Amsterdam Cafe getting high openly. Now I don't advocate busting ANYBODY but if their going to bust anybody then it shouldn't be little old ladies? There isn't ANYBODY subsidising medical patients here, I could fit all the weed I have seen given away here into a sandwich baggy. At 10$ a gram, cannabis is harder to come by here for most clubs than for kids who want to get high. If we have to hide the truth or lie to win I am not so sure we ever will. It's high time this so-called movement layed some cards on the table and owned up to some problems so we can work on fixing them. Peace, steven tuck in exile [ Post Comment ] Comment #2 posted by WolfgangWylde on October 19, 2002 at 11:15:09 PT Maybe someone... ...with a better knowledge of the Canadian system can comment - but did last year's Supreme Court decision mean nothing at all? It certainly seems so. [ Post Comment ] Comment #1 posted by afterburner on October 19, 2002 at 10:57:05 PT: I Hope You Read This, Ottawa. Ottawa does not want to become the nation's pot pusherNo one's asking that. Does Ottawa "push" alcohol by allowing provincial liquor control boards to operate retail stores displaying and selling the wares of brewers, vintners, and distillers or to license bars to sell the products. Does Ottawa "push" tobacco by collecting taxes on cigarettes and prohibiting their sale to minors? The federal government could provide regulations whereby authorized marijuana suppliers were sanctioned by the government, for example a co-operative arrangement could be worked out with groups like the Toronto Compassion Centre. Ottawa does not need to grow marijuana itself; in fact, it didn't grow the Flin Flon crop: it contracted a private business to grow the crop for them. [ Post Comment ] Post Comment